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michaelwalker123

IMS Bearing Type By Engine Serial # ?

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At the risk of beating this topic to glue, I have read in past postings that there was a final factory-modified IMS bearing that began to be used in 987-2 cars and that the switch ocurred sometime in the 2006 MY. I have also read that the most accurate way of determining which upgrade is required is to do it by engine serial number. My engine serial number is 2662603449.

Can someone assist me in determining which bearing I have currently and if I should consider upgrading it based on which type it is? I know this is a personal judgement but some bearing designs seem to fail more than others. Thanks for the assitance!

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Actually, Porsche transitioned to the larger diameter IMS bearing in late 2005, all 2006 (and on) cars or replacement engines have the larger bearing as well.

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Actually, Porsche transitioned to the larger diameter IMS bearing in late 2005, all 2006 (and on) cars or replacement engines have the larger bearing as well.

Even though it is an '06 model, my build date was 11/2005 which would seem to be on the cusp of the change to the new bearing. Are you saying anything designated as MY 2006 would have the larger bearing? If so, would this be the one that cannot be changed out by removing the transmission and would in fact have to be taken apart to upgrade? Thanks for the clarification.

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We have seen late MY '05's that have the "non serviceable" large diameter bearing. All MY '06's (or any earlier MY that had a replacement engine installed after 1/06) would definitely have the larger bearing, which requires total engine disassembly to replace.

Edited by JFP in PA

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We have seen late MY '05's that have the "non serviceable" large diameter bearing. All MY '06's (or any earlier MY that had a replacement engine installed after 1/06) would definitely have the larger bearing, which requires total engine disassembly to replace.

Thanks for the clarification. I'm not going to worry about it then...just enjoy the car.

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I have heard conflicting information on how clean the cutover to the new bearing was. From some sources it wasn't a clean cutoff point and they worked them in over time. Mine is also around the same engine code as yours listed above with a build date 10/05. Our engines are M96 and not the M97 that started with MY2006 cars. I haven't seen anything to confirm that the new IMS was tied to M97 vs M96 motors but that would make some sense.

Most places including the dealer and Jake Raby are telling me they can't be sure unless you remove the clutch. At $20k miles, seems a bit pricey to do a clutch job this early for the what if.

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Jake is correct. Some cars built in 2005 have the "final solution" IMS that cannot be changed without splitting the cases (total disassembly of the engine). Neither build dates nor serial numbers have proven to be accurate. The only way to know for sure which IMS is in a 2005 car is to pull the flywheel and look at it. As unpalatable as this is, it is an unfortunate fact of life. All 2006 on are definitely non serviceable, as are earlier model cars that had an engine change after around mid to late 2005.

Edited by JFP in PA

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Please forgive the n00bie qiestion but if buying a 987.1 now, in addition to getting a PPI performed and assuming the cars are of equal condition, would it be better to buy a 987 with the older serviceable bearing or the one with the later but "non serviceable" bearing. Would it be fair to assume that the later bearing, although "non servicable", has had less catastrophic failures?

Likewise M96 or M97 engine? (if that isn't exactly the same question as above)


Even though it is an '06 model, my build date was 11/2005 which would seem to be on the cusp of the change to the new bearing.

The build date versus the MY designation is a bit of a source of confusion to a novice.
I see a lot of people refer to their cars as "2006 MY07" etc.
Can anyone pls explain how the build date and the MY year nomenclature is meant to work. What is the correct convention?

Thanks

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:welcome:

Most auto manufacturers begin building the next years model in July or August of the previous year. So from a production point of view you can buy a car that is a model year 2007 car that was built in July/August of 2006.

That car will be sold as as 2007 model year car as it has all the components and options that will be used for that model year.

With that said you need to be careful with smaller part changes as Porsche (like others) can change parts with little or no notice. sometimes this is a vendor issue, sometimes it is a price issue, and sometimes it is a design issue.

Unless the replacement part makes a significant difference in installation or performance a part number change may or may not occur. As well, a Technical Service Bulletin ( TSB) may or may not be released.

Unfortunately in this case of the IMS - the latest solution change-over date and production VINs were not well controlled. So the window of "unknown" actual implementation is much wider than most normal circumstances.

So for these reasons sometime the engine needs to be inspected to find which IMS version was used.

None us likely it to be that way but that is the way it is.

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Thanks for your post. So should a car built in say Sep 06, be referred to as a 2006 MY07? Would it be wrong to refer to it as a 2007 MY07?

What lets you know a car is a MY07? the books?

And re the other query, would it be better to buy a 987 with the older serviceable bearing or one with the later but "non serviceable" bearing?

And since the engine number will specify whether its a M96 or M97 engine, is it better going for a M97 if you have the choice? (assume condition is the same).

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Thanks for your post. So should a car built in say Sep 06, be referred to as a 2006 MY07? Would it be wrong to refer to it as a 2007 MY07?

What lets you know a car is a MY07? the books?

And re the other query, would it be better to buy a 987 with the older serviceable bearing or one with the later but "non serviceable" bearing?

And since the engine number will specify whether its a M96 or M97 engine, is it better going for a M97 if you have the choice? (assume condition is the same).

The original paperwork determines the model year, as it is what the state uses to title the car.

The M96 vs. M97 depends upon where your head is at; if the possibility of an IMS failure concerns you, a car that can be updated would be preferable. If you are comfortable living with the non-serviceable IMS lower but still persistent failure rates, then the M97 would be fine.

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Mav is in Australia....different rules may apply about "what model year" a car could be titled as. IIRC it was the US that started assigning model years that were a "fiscal year" where cars built in late MY - 1 would be titled as a MY. IIRC in Europe generally cars were titled as to the actual build date, although this may have changed. I know this was a headache in my Austin Healey days.

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What year a vehicle is "titled" in a country is really irrelevant.

If you view model year and build date from Porsche's point of view - then parts, repairs, and mods will always be per factory designations.

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What year a vehicle is "titled" in a country is really irrelevant.

If you view model year and build date from Porsche's point of view - then parts, repairs, and mods will always be per factory designations.

+1, which is why the part counter guy at your dealer often asks for the car's VIN number, from that he knows exactly what is in the car, regardless of what anyone calls it.

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If you are comfortable living with the non-serviceable IMS lower but still persistent failure rates, then the M97 would be fine.

Are there any stats on how much lower?

What year a vehicle is "titled" in a country is really irrelevant.

I think I need to clarify what I meant. ... "What lets you know a car is a MY07?" meant ... when buying a second hand 987 privately, what is the thing to look at to determine whether its a MY07? Is it the Servicebook? Something else? Is there any way to tell from a listing or do you need to look at the paperwork?

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If you are comfortable living with the non-serviceable IMS lower but still persistent failure rates, then the M97 would be fine.

Are there any stats on how much lower?

What year a vehicle is "titled" in a country is really irrelevant.

I think I need to clarify what I meant. ... "What lets you know a car is a MY07?" meant ... when buying a second hand 987 privately, what is the thing to look at to determine whether its a MY07? Is it the Servicebook? Something else? Is there any way to tell from a listing or do you need to look at the paperwork?

There are no "hard" stats on the final IMS design as Porsche has continued to be tight lipped, so all the information is second hand. But they can and do fail.

If you want to know what year Porsche thinks the car is, you need to run the VIN and/or find the build date.

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There are no "hard" stats ... But they can and do fail.

Any educated guesstimations?

*****

And on the other issue, I'm not having much progress/luck here.

From the outset, I mentioned that "I see a lot of people refer to their cars as "2006 MY07".

So if a car can have a buld date in 2006 and yet be called a MY07 - then the build year isn't the answer I'm looking for.

I think i'm generally pretty good at articulating but maybe the issue is just so simple that people are missing the crux of my question. I just want to know what makes a car an MY07! and "build date" isn't really the answer if you can have both MY07's and MY06's built in Aug 2006. Is "MY07" written somewhere?

I thought when "The original paperwork" was mentioned above, that that was the answer to the question and that it would therefore be somewhere in the books - and that therefore was the end of the question.

NB: Does "running the VIN" mean via a dealer? I just want to know if there's a simple way you can know for yourself.

Edited by MavRT

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There are no "hard" stats ... But they can and do fail.

Any educated guesstimations?

*****

And on the other issue, I'm not having much progress/luck here.

From the outset, I mentioned that "I see a lot of people refer to their cars as "2006 MY07".

So if a car can have a buld date in 2006 and yet be called a MY07 - then the build year isn't the answer I'm looking for.

I think i'm generally pretty good at articulating but maybe the issue is just so simple that people are missing the crux of my question. I just want to know what makes a car an MY07! and "build date" isn't really the answer if you can have both MY07's and MY06's built in Aug 2006. Is "MY07" written somewhere?

I thought when "The original paperwork" was mentioned above, that that was the answer to the question and that it would therefore be somewhere in the books - and that therefore was the end of the question.

NB: Does "running the VIN" mean via a dealer? I just want to know if there's a simple way you can know for yourself.

I'm really not sure what you are attempting to accomplish, but people can say anything they want about their cars; however there is only one correct model year for any given vehicle, which typically listed on the title and registration for the car.

If you have the 17 digit VIN for the car in question, you can enter it into Scouser's Porsche VIN Decoder (Documents tab at the top of the page), and it will break down what Porsche thinks the car is, which is pretty much exactly what I would expect the car's title would say. A dealer can also decode the VIN using a different software, but should come to the same results.

The only people that have accurate data on the IMS failure rates is Porsche, and they are not talking. We have seen a few, but have no idea if that is representative of the entire population. Any number thrown out is pure speculation.

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June 30, 2014

 

Hello Forum:

 

I don’t know a lot of technical stuff about Boxsters so I leave that to my Porsche service technicians. I do know that I really enjoy driving my Boxster and I certainly don’t want it to outlive me. Unfortunately my Boxster is in full agreement with my view on life.

 

I experienced an IMS failure a few weeks ago apparently due to a broken center intermediate shaft assembly bolt caused by its weak design (http://www.pelicanparts.com/techarticles/Boxster_Tech/14-ENGINE-Intermediate_Shaft_Bearing/14-ENGINE-Intermediate_Shaft_Bearing.htm). So as expected, the engine oil made a mess on the parking lot and the engine was destroyed.

 

For everyone that has not yet experienced an IMS failure, here is what I found important in my recent experience that could help you decide upon the level of anxiety that you may wish to inflict upon yourselves prior to your impending IMS failure:

 

Educate yourself and read up on the IMS Class Action Settlement.

http://www.imsporschesettlement.com/

 

Check to see if your VIN number is covered “Class” vehicle. In my case, it appears that they did not go by engine serial number to determine a “Class” vehicle.

http://www.imsporschesettlement.com/faqs/#qq5

 

Figure out how much money you will receive for your IMS failure depending on the mileage and purchase type.

http://www.imsporschesettlement.com/faqs/#qq8

 

When your IMS fails, see your Porsche dealer, after they have qualified you, fill out the claim form from and wait.

 

In my case, my used 2005 Boxster S with a qualifying VIN number with 64K miles and with a certified pre-owned certificate was 100% covered. I got lucky because the replacement cost for this engine was a little north of $20K. I am also lucky that the failure occurred after the January 30, 2014 class action settlement date so my repair cost reimbursement was not affected by the class action appeal.

 

I would say that anybody with a used Boxster with a qualifying VIN number with 50K to 90K miles and with a certified pre owned is looking pretty good; other pre owned Boxsters - not so good; higher mileage new Boxster purchaser - so so.

 

I just drove the Boxster home today after waiting 6 weeks for a new engine. It has a newer engine with, I assume, the larger non removable IMS bearing and the beefed up intermediate shaft assembly bolt. I am sure that at some point in time this IMS too will fail. When it does, it will be time to scrap the car.  Until then, I will continue to drive my Boxster to its ultimate destruction so that it will not outlive me.

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