Radio

[atmorris]

>I planned on making a scale CAD drawing of the door mounts and attaching it to the write up in a couple of formats for anyone to use. This way you could print out a template to start from.<

1- ALAN, This would be really fantastic for many guys now and in the future!

Jig sawing baffle board or plywood is well within the skills of most amateur diy'ers, but what intimidates me is the trial and error cutting out the right size price firsthand.

I'm up for mailing a beer fund in cash immediately if you can get a drawing up, as I'm ready to do the door upgrade.

2- 95% finished installing the huge magnet Boston s45's (4" coax) in Dash a'la Jinster. Mounting depth was over 2.2", and sure enough...left side dropped in fine...but the right side nudges against the bolt head... <_< . Drops in all the way if I twist it a tad, but grill does not lie perfectly flush. So..I will Dremel off 1/8" of an inch off the bolt and/or speaker magnet, and should drop in just perfectly.

What I did:

- I Broke apart the plastic Nokia speaker bracket to use it as a mount, like Jinster. 10 minute job, used metal cutter scissors.

- To drop the s45 fit into the Nokia bracket, I had to clip (same metal cutters) the 4 mounting tabs almost completely off, and left just a bit so they fit snugly. Too snugly as it turns out, had to Dremel the inside perimiter of the Nokia braket a tad. And, I cut a bit too much off some of the tabs, so Epoxy was needed to secure the criver in the Nokia bracket.

- I dropped some thick epoxy on each tab, and screwed the whole thing back in with the standard 3 screws.

- I reused the existing connectors, soldered female part to speaker s45 wires/clips.

As others have indicated, replacement sounds GREAT.

What I learned:

- 2.2" is pushing it if you don't want to grind the bolt or magnet. 2" depth replacement drivers eliminates this problem.

- Be careful clipping the tabs, to leave enough so they fit snug.

- I wanted to do this beause I enjoy DIY'ing, and challenged myself to fit the Bostons. If someone wants less hassle, VFBox's adapters are probably a simple way to go than clipping, dremeling, etc...

- Thick GEL epoxy (2 part) works well and does not spill where we don't want it to.

Test:

- With the stock tweeters still in place, hmm...I wonder if they would still be useable and of sufficient quality (suspectful) to compliment the s45. So I connected one of them, just soldered the wires to the s45 input in series. I would think 2 different tweeters (stock and the coax of the s45) may sound weird or not in phase, OR they may compliment each other and expand the highs, with the stock tweeter poiting in a different way. Could not tell a differerence yet, will test further this evening in quiet.

This has been a great thread, building on things done in the past.

Next steps:

6x40 amp

Harvey Peck Rear kit

Kenwood sub

Door replacement

PS: Does anyone know if the 6x40 amp does NOT have the high pass crossover or filter that I assume the 4x40 has? (Which would be why only low's go to the doors) Reason is, I hope all 6 channels drive all frequencies, so I can get full range from the doors. Thanks!

I'll get the template up there as quick as I can. I should have the write up posted this weekend. In the interim, the process I used was this: I made a cardboard template using the front of the original speaker enclosure first. Then fitted it against the door. I kept making adjustments to the template and making new templates until I got it just right. Be sure to pay attention to the inside of the door panel as well, there are a couple of features on the door panel that will have to be planned for as well (plastic gussets and stiffening features around the retainers.) At the front lower edge of the door panel there are long plastic gussets that I modified to allow the speaker panel to clear perfectly. I just dremmeled off the upper 1/2" of those gussets. This still leaves plenty of gusset to accomplish the intended reinforcement.

I believe that the 6x40 amp feeds subwoofer output to the doors but I am not 100% certain. You could alwys unplug the door out feeds and tap them into the fronts to get a full range signal, but that will present an 8 ohm load and reduce their volume. Of course you could probably just adjust the fader to compensate as the rears are so close to your head to begin with...there really isn't any need though. With the rear kit inplace and good speakers all around the sound stage is quite a bit more natural and balanced, and those doors will produce some much needed bottom end.

P.S. using the modified stock mounting system in the dash, I had some issues with that bolt as well. I was going to replace it with a 1/2" shorter bolt. However, using vfxbox's rings I had no problem on that side, so I didn't need to change the bolt anyway.

Next up for me:

Head unit that has receiver,plays MP3s, video, and maybe nav (Pioneer AVIC-D2 ?)

new 6 channel amp with just a bit more power - maybe 60 x4 + 120 x 2

Andy

[atmorris]

OK, I got all the documentation of the speaker system update done (still working on the template) and will post the doc tonight under the DIY MODS section.

I am still working on the template, but that doesn't have to hold anyone up - the documentation is pretty clear on how to do this and most of you should be able to develop your own templates easy enough.

[Tool Pants]

I have been looking on ebay for a 6X40 watt M490 996 amp, as I might put rear speakers in my 1997 Box.

What I have noticed from the ebay pictures is that there is a cabrio and coupe amp. I know nothing about amps or 996s, except that a 996 cab is a fat Box. :D

I would assume I need a 996 cab amp, but I see more coupe amps.

Any of you audio people know if it makes any difference to get a 6X40 amp from a coupe vs. a cab?

[Cassiebox]

Either the coupe or a cab one will work. What's important is the pin connection (which you'll be able to tell if they are the same by picture - some earlier Nokia amps and Bose amps had tiny pins). More importantly is if it's a M490 or M680. With your '97, you'll want the M490 6x40 amp. Otherwise, you'll also need the M680 control panel for your center consol. The M680 was the DSP option and would also require running an add'l harness into the cockpit to control the bass, etc. aside from the stereo functions, etc. Good luck and I wouldn't pay over $100. Otherwise, you'd be better off just getting and aftermarket 6x amp so you can get full sound from your door speakers too.

[atmorris]

Either the coupe or a cab one will work. What's important is the pin connection (which you'll be able to tell if they are the same by picture - some earlier Nokia amps and Bose amps had tiny pins). More importantly is if it's a M490 or M680. With your '97, you'll want the M490 6x40 amp. Otherwise, you'll also need the M680 control panel for your center consol. The M680 was the DSP option and would also require running an add'l harness into the cockpit to control the bass, etc. aside from the stereo functions, etc. Good luck and I wouldn't pay over $100. Otherwise, you'd be better off just getting and aftermarket 6x amp so you can get full sound from your door speakers too.

Hang on a sec.....I'm confused. The M490 amp is MOST bus I believe. If so, how would the Amp work without a MOST bus HU, because the HU is the master on the MOST bus. Remove the HU and the entire MOST system is down, so there would be no communication between the HU and the amp. The '97 doesn't have MOST bus HU.....or are there different "versions" of the M490 architecture?

[Cassiebox]

I apologize as I should have explained more fully. Yes, there are different M490 architectures depending on MY. For instance, my 99 has the M490, but only has a 4x40 amp. The '03-'04 models that have the M490 include a 6x40 amp (which I think are the MOST systems). I do not think a MOST amp will work in a non-MOST system and I seem to recall seeing somewhere that the pin hook ups for the MOST system are completely different sized, etc. but could be mistaken.

Anyhow, I do know for certain that the M680 amp will not work in a M490 system w/out the extra control panel for the interior. I think as long as you find a HAES 6x40 amp you'll be fine. Specifically, you should be looking for part # 996.645.311.00 or 996.645.313.00 w/ the M490. I was able to get part# 996.645.313.00 and it works great in my 99.

[atmorris]

I apologize as I should have explained more fully. Yes, there are different M490 architectures depending on MY. For instance, my 99 has the M490, but only has a 4x40 amp. The '03-'04 models that have the M490 include a 6x40 amp (which I think are the MOST systems). I do not think a MOST amp will work in a non-MOST system and I seem to recall seeing somewhere that the pin hook ups for the MOST system are completely different sized, etc. but could be mistaken.

Anyhow, I do know for certain that the M680 amp will not work in a M490 system w/out the extra control panel for the interior. I think as long as you find a HAES 6x40 amp you'll be fine. Specifically, you should be looking for part # 996.645.311.00 or 996.645.313.00 w/ the M490. I was able to get part# 996.645.313.00 and it works great in my 99.

OK...that makes more sense to me. You are correct, starting with MY03 , the M490 amps are MOST based.

Performance wise though Tool Pants, there are many aftermarket amps out there that will out perform the stock M490 unit handily (in the same price range), so unless one of your requirements is to remain pure OEM, you might want to look in that direction. JBL, Kicker, Diamond, Audiobahn,Phoenix, to name a few.

[Tool Pants]

I know not to use a a DSP or MOST amp, and I doubt if I could use a 2002 Bose amp since it is digital.

To be safe I will look around for a 1999, 2000, and maybe a 2001 996 amp

My January 1997 has a Nokia amp. But I have seen Haes and Harman amps. I always thought Porsche simply had more than one supplier, or you got one brand for a Finland car and another brand for a German car.

I would not pay more than $30 for a crappy Porsche amp. :D But I do want the OEM look.

I will ask Peter if he knows why there is a coupe and cab amp. This question was sort of asked here. http://www.renntech.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=3389

[insite]

i found the answer to our BASS problems. this is a 10" blaupunkt sub with a 2" mounting depth. anyone hear these?

Now all we need is 10" of free space to mount them in...tough to come by in a Boxster :P

Seriously ....Where did you find these ? Interesting design....

saw a write-up on these subs online. i'm going to build two large, thin enclosures to go behind the seats. they will taper at the top. the idea is to provide enough internal volume for a great sounding sealed enclosure while still letting me put the seat back almost all the way.

[atmorris]

i found the answer to our BASS problems. this is a 10" blaupunkt sub with a 2" mounting depth. anyone hear these?

Now all we need is 10" of free space to mount them in...tough to come by in a Boxster :P

Seriously ....Where did you find these ? Interesting design....

saw a write-up on these subs online. i'm going to build two large, thin enclosures to go behind the seats. they will taper at the top. the idea is to provide enough internal volume for a great sounding sealed enclosure while still letting me put the seat back almost all the way.

Let us know how you make out.

[Kevlar986]

I just wanted to add to the discussion on the door speakers. I installed a complete new system, Nak400, amp and dash/door speakers, and the Kenwood sub and Harvey's pnp kit. The door/dash and rears are run through an a/d/s 6 channel amp (old school I found). I can even run my mp3 player directly thru the Nak, without that modulator thing. It rocks!!!

For the door speakers I recommend the Rainbow CS 265 X-Plain. These are German made speakers that have a very shallow mounting depth, the specs say 43 mm. They are a 6.5 and easily fit the space with the use of a baffle to take the place of the Nokia plastic things. They are a very quality speaker. I have the sub mounted in the passenger footwell on the side by the middle hump and covered it with black carpet. it is not uncomfortable for the passenger, which is usually a petite female, although it might be a problem if your passenger is a middle linebacker with huge legs. Otherwise it is easily removed.

email me if you have any questions, thanks.

[toddhata]

Last night I did some similar mods to my dad's 02 Carrera, father's day gift. I put the MB Quart RCE 210 in the dash, and added the Becker ipod aux input with the Belkin mod hard wired to the phone power. Quick and easy and made his basic system sound so much better. Everything is exactly the same as my 00 Boxster so it made it really easy. Now he wants a new system in his Tacoma.

[atmorris]

Last night I did some similar mods to my dad's 02 Carrera, father's day gift. I put the MB Quart RCE 210 in the dash, and added the Becker ipod aux input with the Belkin mod hard wired to the phone power. Quick and easy and made his basic system sound so much better. Everything is exactly the same as my 00 Boxster so it made it really easy. Now he wants a new system in his Tacoma.

Your a good son. :cheers:

[davej_anderson]

For the door speakers I recommend the Rainbow CS 265 X-Plain. These are German made speakers that have a very shallow mounting depth, the specs say 43 mm. They are a 6.5 and easily fit the space with the use of a baffle to take the place of the Nokia plastic things. They are a very quality speaker.

email me if you have any questions, thanks.

I've got a set of the Rainbow 265slcs that I'm going to try to mount to the doors. Did you modify the plastic speaker enclosure or did you create a new mounting board?

Any pics?

[atmorris]

Are you sure you want to do this? The door speakers are designed to be subs all be it small ones. If you block the bass to them they will probably produce a really muddy mid range. If you want to alter the door speakers from subs to full range you really should just replace the speakers.

Jon

It isn't quite that simple. The crossovers are built into the stock amp. You can't get full range out of the door speakers by just replacing them. You could tap the door speaker leads into the front (or rear) channel outputs, but this will change the impedence load on the front speaker outs from 4 to 8 ohms. That will make the amp even less efficient than it already is, but it is doable. The only other option would be to change out both the amp and the speakers, but then there is the problem of HU to amp connections if your car is a MOST bus system, so you wind up changing out the HU as well. I don't think this is an issue on pre-MOST systems, but I have no experience with them.

[Kevlar986]

For the door speakers I recommend the Rainbow CS 265 X-Plain. These are German made speakers that have a very shallow mounting depth, the specs say 43 mm. They are a 6.5 and easily fit the space with the use of a baffle to take the place of the Nokia plastic things. They are a very quality speaker.

email me if you have any questions, thanks.

I've got a set of the Rainbow 265slcs that I'm going to try to mount to the doors. Did you modify the plastic speaker enclosure or did you create a new mounting board?

Any pics?

I don't have any pics, but I removed the plastic baffles and used a styrofoam baffle and mounted the speaker inside that and mounted it to the door. You could try and use the plastic thing but will probably need to cut it a little to account for the bigger speaker.

[davej_anderson]

I'm just weighing up the benfits/disadvatages of using the exisiting housing vs. wooden baffle.

Prob going for modifying the exisiting baffle

[atmorris]

I'm just weighing up the benfits/disadvatages of using the exisiting housing vs. wooden baffle.

Prob going for modifying the exisiting baffle

When I did mine, I used 3/4" oak for the mount plate, covered with sound deadening material. It would have been a bit better if I had used 5/8" oak but 3/4" is what I had around. I didn't reuse the plastic "tuned" port enclosure. For one thing, it isn't tuned to a 6 1/2" driver anyway. I also didn't put any accoustical materials on the inside of the doors, as I didn't want to provide a water trap. The bass is clean, it does not sound boomy or exagerated. It does vibrate my mirrors a little, but not annoyingly. I am using the stock 6x40 amp right now though. I have a 6x100W amp to install, and that may change things and cause some issues, but I won't use this amp until I change the HU out.

Edited July 19, 2006 by Andy_M

[klueless7571]

I just received my Pioneer DEH-9800BT and the PAC OEM kit from Crutchfield. Wondering if anyone have done this similar upgrade because I'm not sure if I need the PAC OEM kit. Can I use the Pioneer's 5V pre-outs directly into the Boxster's stock amp?

Derek

[klueless7571]

Well, this kinda sucks. Now I understand why they say you need the PAC OEM2 universal kit. The wiring harness (70-1784) they supply is only good for direct headunit to speaker connections. If you have the amp, then you will need a separate wiring harness for the pre-amp wiring - which of course doesn't come with the kit from Crutchfield. Perhaps there isn't one available at all, I don't know. So you would need to either use the PAC OEM2 universal kit to down convert from the speaker outputs of the headunit into pre-amp outputs for the M460 or else splice into the Boxsters wiring harness for the pre-amp connections. What a drag. Looks like I'll splice into the wires because I'm really not keen on degrading the sound quality through another unnecessary piece of electronic gadget.

Sigh...

I'll probably end up replacing the M460 with a real 6 channel amp after I get Harvey's PNP rears, so I suppose it's not a big deal.

Time to start cutting!

Derek

[klueless7571]

Got it installed and working in a couple hours. Didn't use the PAC OEM2 interface, but just spliced and soldered the Boxster's wiring harness. There wasn't any way around splicing even if I wanted to use the PAC OEM2 interface. Instructions were slightly off on the wiring harness connections but it was simple to figure out.

This Pioneer DEH-9800BT unit is awesome. The only thing I'm missing is the iPod adaptor - Crutchfield is out of stock and will be shipping it to me asap - I can't wait. No more messing around with wires and the aux input on the Becker.

Still reading the manual on the Pioneer, but I'm running into a small bump using the Bluetooth. It's a non-Porsche problem but basically my ipaq 6515 isn't automatically reconnecting with the Pioneer when I re-enter the car. Other than that, I'm extremely happy with the install, and the sound quality blows the Becker CDR-220 out of the water!

Can't wait to upgrade the speakers :D

Derek

[Charlestonboxster]

I'm just weighing up the benfits/disadvatages of using the exisiting housing vs. wooden baffle.

Prob going for modifying the exisiting baffle

I just finished the whole Dash/Door upgrade, somewhat similar to what Andy did.

See my signature for Audio upgrade.

I did it with a lot of phone consulting from Jamey in LA, formerly from Paris Audio, he has 10 years experience as a full time high end car audio installer in LA, owns his own business, and knows Porsche installs like the back of his hand.

a) He can cut and ship you wood baffles and the screws for about $60-$70.

B) I drew a true size template of the baffles he supplied me, it's on a 11"x17" sheet, and I can email a PDF document of them to anyone, in case you want to cut them yourself with a Jigsaw.

Hope this helps.

When I have a bit more time, I'll post what I did and what I learned!

I also have a CDR210, OEM 4 channel, OEM 6 channel amp, one mounting bracket, for sale, cheap, if they can help anyone's basic system.

Tony

[atmorris]

Tony,

Any pics of the Alpine 9857 HU installed? How "un-stock" (fit wise) does it look mounted ? Still making up my mind what way to go with the HU.

[Charlestonboxster]

1- Here is Alpine Installed. The blu glo lights stand out at night. Wife liked them, not me. I did a little bit of electronic mod, opened up the cover of the retractable head part (very small phillip screws), and put a piece of tape over the blu glo light LED's to subdue them. Quite easy actually, Unit is now much more discreet at night.

If it helps anyone, here are various pictures of modification of Dash Grills.

First step was the OEM Basket mod elsewhere on this board, I added Boston 4" coaxes fitted into borken/mod basket. As upgrade, I removed Bostons (seen here next to new mids) and went seperate mid and tweeter as part of JL audio XR 3 way. Mid driver mounted in basket seen in second pic

Here is a good pic of the grill with the original sized tweeter hole, which I am about to dremel to make bigger for the 1 inch component tweeter. TIP Place a thick piece of cardboard inside the grill, under where you are dremleing, or you might hit right thru the grill...

Here is the grill with new tweeter hole done. Tweeter barely slides into here with a few edges catching enough to hold while being epoxied...

Here is Tweeter epoxied into hole. Used 2 part GEL epoxy (Lowes) thickened with talcum (baby powder) so it sticks well and does not "drip" anywhere. Worked very well, just used a toothpick. Second pic is a close up.

After that, simply mounted mid basket back into grill with original screws and location.

Now had 2 drivers and only one OEM wire though, so had to run second wire down and out of dash holes and to the crossovers, which are in the trunk.

I hope this, ad the other thread on the OEM dash grill mod, helps anyone ready to tackle the DIY Dash speaker Mod!

Reminder: I have the door baffle template in a PDF doc, and a word document with a bunch hof notes, I can email them to anyone.

Tony

[ninpo4me]

On the '03-'04, the M490 option does include a 6x amp. '02 and prior only include a 4x amp. Mine is a '99 and I originally only had a 4x40 as part of my M490. As I recall, I think the original question was regarding an '02 which would be the same.

As for the crossover to door speakers, I'm pretty sure (but not 100%) it's fixed and part of the amp circuitry. Therefore, even if you swapped out the doors w/ full range speakers, you'd still only get low.

You are right! I did swap out the doors speakers for Infinity Ref. 5" and only lows come out still. Do you think if I replace the OEM amp, they will be full sounding again!?