986Rick

Also, for those in the future searching for this CEL code and what it means, I present the following:

The P0650 indicates a problem with the actual CEL (check engine light). Ignition voltage is supplied directly to the malfunction indicator lamp (MIL). The PCM (powertrain control module) controls the lamp by grounding the control circuit via an internal switch called a driver. The primary function of the driver is to supply the ground for the component being controlled. The driver has a fault line which is monitored by the PCM. When the PCM is commanding a component ON, the voltage of the control circuit should be low, near 0 volts. When the PCM is commanding the component control circuit OFF, the voltage potential of the circuit should be high, near battery voltage. If the fault detection circuit senses a voltage other than what is expected, the fault line status will change causing the diagnostic trouble code (DTC) to set.

Usually it's traced to a burned out CEL light, but it can also be a cut or grounded line to the CEL.

Best way to *quickly* check it is as follows:

Is the CEL (Check Engine Light) always on?

• If it is, the Check Engine switch or lines may be shorted closed. This will probably be a bear to find.

Does the CEL turn on when you first start the car (all the dash lights should come on)?

• If the answer is NO, either the light is burned out or the harness has a break in it. The former is easy. the latter not so.

The best way to troubleshoot around this (after checking the above) is to ask yourself what electronics you were near during your last repair. If the problem isn't a burned out bulb, odds are you made the break or short when you were last near the lines going to the dash (or, in my case, changing another bulb in the dash), or to the PCM (under the driver's seat). Reverse your steps, and look for something obvious.

Hopefully this will save someone some hair in the future. Mine's already mostly gone, which is why Bruce Willis and I share the same barber.

-R.

The diagnostics Loren mentioned are also a good start, as the MIL signal itself could be the issue.

No one ever said diagnostics where easy; but they can be fun.........

The CEL being burned out turned out to be my exact issue.

Maddening. Totally maddening. Mostly because I just finished replacing my alternator, replacing my entire clutch hydraulics, and (I'm about to replace) my clutch.

Sorry if I disagree about diagnostics being fun. Car electronics just suck. :-)

-R.

how old is the battery?

possibly clogged fuel filter, pressure regulator?

I've seen cranky batteries on boats do odd things to other systems like demonic possessions. You battery is under voltage for starting.

How old is it? Have you charged it externally and do you have a load tester? If not off to FLAPS with your battery now!

Well, the battery is only 2-1/2 years old. Fortunately, I bought it from Costco (about a week after I bought the car, which still had the OEM battery in it...but that's a different story).

On a whim, I decided to take advantage of Costco's beyond excellent return policy, and got a fresh battery up in South City.

Just finished dropping it in. this time I had all the access panels off and could see everything that was going on. There was a slight "burning rubber" smell that I didn't think much of before (mostly because the engine has a bit of burn off from poorly managed oil separator maintenance from the prior owner), but after cranking the motor with the fresh battery, it was totally obvious what was going on.

My alternator is as frozen as a woolly mammoth in a glacier. All the other pulley's spin, but the alternator is acting like a brake on the serpentine belt. I'm guessing that the alternator died and seized up(?)

I won't know for sure, of course, until I get a new part on Monday from Parts Heaven. Probably do the serpentine and the ignition switch both anyway for good measure, as both probably could stand replacing.

I guess I should ask the question, though, "is there anything I might be missing that would lock the alternator?"

I think not, but it wouldn't be the first time I "thought" I was sure....

Thanks again guys, and I will post regardless of the outcome. Maybe even DIY the alternator swap-out(?)

I'll definitely do some FA on the alternator as well.

-Rick

PS: When you think about it, daaaayum, that starter motor has some bad-a** torque to be able to turn the motor with a seized pulley under tension. wow.

And even more info...

No change in the ability to turn the engine, however, while I'm cranking, the hazards flash and the windows go up and down (if the doors are closed).

Demonic possession, perhaps?

(and I just bought her new rear discs and shoes...sheesh.)

Thanks in advance!

-Rick

My comments are automotive experience "in general" and not from Boxster experience, so take them for what they are worth. If nobody gives you anything concrete they are worth considering.

I'm with RFM since you are not throwing any codes. I would guess every piece of the ignition/timing system that is capable of failing is going to show up with a CEL. Now I have no experience with a Boxster and fuel pumps but I just got done replacing the pump in my Saab 9-5 wagon and it had no codes either. It was very easy to test the pump on that car as first you can hear the pump running with the ignition on and the pump was easy to get out to bench test. I am going to guess the hum of that pump with the front boot open is going to be obvious. Also from my experience pumps either fail or don't, no in between. So you will hear the pump and it's working 100% good or you will not hear it and it's 100% bad.

In the last 5 years I've had 3 pump failures in my fleet. Some came with warnings I did not heed and other slapped me across the face once at 75mph on the freeway with no warning! I assumed far worse in all cases only to take a deep breath, pull out the multi-tester and solve the issue.

Lastly, I had a Vw Eurovan and Vw Vanagon do the same thing which turned out to be a bad ground cable from the starter to the transmission (if I recall) and the other had a bad cable from the starter to the alternator. Corrosion.

a little more info:

I did a direct connection from battery negative to the engine lift to test for faulty ground: no change.

I do hear the fuel pump motor, but it sounds somewhat sickly (like a stepper motor under voltage): is that normal?

Battery is reading 11.7 volts--seemed low, so...

I did a direct jump from my wife's car: tried to turn over, bud didn't catch

Driveshaft does turn with a wrench, so it doesn't appear to be a seized motor/mechanical issue.

There is a lingering smell of burnt oil, but that has always been the case in the engine compartment.

Have you checked the fuel pump ?

Not yet. Top of my list, as soon as I can muster up enough neighbors to get her in the garage and jacked up.

I did go down, unlock the door with the second key (manually), then tried the press the gas pedal to the floor while turning her over trick. Sputtered for about 3 seconds, then died. Sickly smell from the exhaust. Like a rich mix.

Anyone else please chime in with ideas...I'll go through them all when I open her up in 8 hours (going to bed. Exhausting experience/day--nothing like being sworn at by every driver passing your stranded car in SF. For a city of pacifists, there sure are allot of...well, you know. Only one kindly lady offered help.)

-Rick

Wow, it's a good thing I love my Boxster, else I'd hate it ;-)

Here's the latest drama in my Porsche relationship--

My wife and I were on an easy drive in heavy fog today on 19th st. in San Francisco, when the engine suddenly cut off. I tried several times to get the car to crank over, to no avail.

Thanks to Geiko, I was able to find a flat bed to bring both my babies home. God, I love my wife. Any lesser woman would have been yelling. She was all over the phone with the tow service while I was outside tending to the car, and setting up the tow hook.

First thing off the bed was to hook up the Durametric. I didn't expect much, as part of my roadside troubleshooting was to disconnect the battery and reset the DME in hopes that the computer just got fouled up by the sudden change from dry weather to fog. No luck...as I expected, no codes were in memory.

So, I did some digging just before posting, and found one gentleman that had a similar issue, and his problem turned out to be the DME main relay. Went downstairs and reseated the fuse. Tried to turn the car over. The starter turned, one cylinder fired, then it stopped. Next, I swapped the DME relay out with another unit that was in the position immediately between the DME relay and the 2ndary air pump fuse. Tried to turn it over again. Same result.

No idea what the heck to look for now. Durametric sees no issues, and the only thing I can think of is that the air was very heavy with water vapor as the fog was thick today.

Any ideas? Anyone?

Thanks all.

-Rick

The Center console armrest on my 1999 Boxster is broken. Is there a simple repair or do I need to purchase an OEM replacement? Any idea what a replacement cost would be? Is this something I can do myself?

Your help would be appreciated. :rolleyes:

1Cruzin

It really depends on how it's broken. On my 986, I ended up getting a new center console with the hinge refit, as the way it was broken (by the previous owner), I couldn't perform the refit.

Another option is used parts. I'm somewhat spoiled by being a rock throw away from Parts Heaven (a Porsche Salvage yard in Hayward, CA www.partsheaven.com), and I have replaced several components in my car with very decent used parts off wrecks.

Otherwise you shell out over $200 bucks for the lid frame or $500 for the console, depending what broke.

d'oh.

-Rick

Guys, thanks for all the info. I thought I'd share some info I've been able to get from "outside traditional channels..."

The mail reason for my looking for this is that I'm replacing/repairing several of interior components on my '00...I think the previous owner:

a. Had more jewelry than Mr. T,

b. Set loose a pair of wolverines in heat inside the cockpit, or

c. Just didn't give a *&%$.

(Probably ©...can't understand some people not respecting their machines, but, well, whatever...)

So anyway, after picking up a "no smoker" ashtray insert replacement at Parts Heaven, I noticed something---my IBM ThinkPad has a remarkably similar finish.

On a whim, I did a search, and someone suggested that a very similar finish could be made by (drumroll please)...

...black chalkboard paint buffed with talcum powder.

So, seeing as I saved the center console I had to rip out and replace, I figure in the next few days I'll use that as a test part for this procedure. If it works, I'll do a DIY on the actual part in the car and post it here.

I'll keep you posted as to the outcome (good *or* bad).

-Rick

Consider it solved. Today, I took Gretta down to the SMOG shop, and she passed with flying colors.

I think I can now access the engine compartment faster than a NASCAR pit crew does a tire change.

To recap, I ended up:

--Replacing the MAF (Thanks, AutohausAZ)

--Replacing the left Pre-Cat O2 sensor

--Replacing the gas cap

Can't stress enough the advice that disconnecting the MAF and resetting the car really assisted in the troubleshooting. Saved me from going down the path of chasing for a vacuum leak that wasn't there.

Chris, Loren, Xster--Thanks.

Now on to bigger, better pcar projects...

-Rick

Hey all--

Does anyone know what that rubber-like coating is on the interior components, and where one might purchase some?

I'm looking to refresh a few scuffed areas on the center console and doors, and I'm having a bear of a time finding a source for this coating.

Thanks in advance,

-Rick

ok so how about a 2004 boxster s front end on a 00 boxster

I believe that all 986 front ends are interchangeable since the headlights did not change as did the 996. However, the vents in the front bumper for the 986 did change in the first facelift so parts of the front bumper are not interchangeable (such as the grill louvres or aftermarket grill mesh)...just the bumper as a whole.

-Alan

100% correct. I'm doing allot of research on this ATM (as my own front and rear bumper covers need replacement).

Be aware that the "996-GT2", if you use GENUINE parts, will also require the GT2 litronics (headlamps), hood, and front BC & ductwork. Not 100% sure about the ground effects panels underneath. LA Porsche part puller, 911-pcar.com, sells this as a kit for ~$5000 complete (unpainted). Love the look, but one may find it hard to pass the funding request through the spousal unit, though.

You can get very decent aftermarket units. There are a few awesome looking GT2-style BCs that make use of the standard Boxster lighting or the Boxster litronics without mods. I'm currently surfing through those to find out who has decent ductwork behind them.

My $0.02--stay away from aftermarket *fiberglass*. Last thing you want is to toe-in to a poorly designed driveway and split your nose open. Go with Fiber reinforced Polyurathane. There's A Reason Porsche Does That .

And, no matter what you get, get a "boomerang." It's a screw in metal skidplate that will keep you from crying the first time you mis-judge nose clearance...

Best regards,

-Rick

NM...I decided to take a chance and go for it anyway. It fits--they just (apparently) added a 5th hole for the 987 e-mount, which just goes unused when mounting the part on on the 986 3.2.

Note to others: you will need two of the new style rubber "bumper gaskets" that fit between the yoke and mount if you get the 987-375-023-04-M100 e-mount, as the profile if the aluminum bolt-core has changed.

All the missed shifts are gone. The core on the old mount was completely sheared off. Took about 5 hours, and in retrospect, I probably would have disconnected the hot coolant return hoses to make access easier. Made for a **** fine Sunday project, though!

Thanks,

-Rick

Has a slightly erratic idle, but I haven't cleaned the Throttle body yet, so it may not be an issue.

That's great Rick, glad you got it figured out. From what I understand from my dealer and experience, eGas throttles will have a slight bounce at idle, mine bounces sightly between 650 - 680 rpms. Nothing to worry about. Good Luck!

Thanks, xSter. She runs like a champ. Shifts better too, now that I replaced the *totally sheared" front engine mount on Sunday. I'll have to post a picture. I'm amazed I wasn't having bigger issues than the occasional missed shift.

Downer is I now get a CEL for P0430 (Cat conversion bank 2 - exceeds limit value)

Could be bad gas, I suppose. I also looked at the seal on my Gas cap and the o-ring does look like it needs replacing, so I'll try that first. Can't think of what else it could be other than the cat actually being bad...but I never saw that cell until after replacing the MAF and the B2 pre-cat O2 sensor.

If it needs a cat I just hope that I'll just squeak in under that 8-year warrantee.

All said and done, I'm happy....she does, after all, have 100K miles as of 3 weeks ago....

-Rick

looks like the MAF was it. replaced it with a new one from AutohausAZ, reset the DME, and she runs like a charm. 75 miles, no CELs or pending codes.

Has a slightly erratic idle, but I haven't cleaned the Throttle body yet, so it may not be an issue.

I'll update if there are any changes.

Thanks guys.

-Rick

Hi all--

I have a 2000 Boxster S (986) up on ramps downstairs.

In a bag next to me, I have the front engine mount for what appears to be a *987*

Part number is 987-375-023-04-M100

According to Pelican, this is an equivalent, but comparing what is (still installed) on my car, and this one, the 987 model appears to have an extra mounting hole (5) as opposed to the one on my car (4).

Can anyone verify that this is a legit substitute? Want to verify so I can--

a.) Be happy, and install the new mount as my Sunday project, or

b.) Be angry, and bring the part back along with my 250ft-lb torque wrench to help the dealer clean out his ear canal on Monday

Thanks!

-Rick

Hi, I am going to do a full brake job once the weather warms up (rotors and pad). And I'm thinking I may as well freshen up the calipers by poweder coating them (I have a home setup for powder coating). The process ends with baking your parts in an oven at about 400 degrees for 10 minutes. I'm thinking its ok since brakes are made to deal with heat. I would obvously just powder the visible areas .Thoughts?

Late reply, but...

That depends on the material sets. If the o-rings are silicone based, you should have no problem, as silicone routinely is used in baking, and those temperatures can sometimes go north of that.

One suggestion: you may want to call one of the guys at AutoAtlanta. They do fast repaints that have factory-like results on the Brembos, and might be able to give you pointers, even if you opt not to have them do it for you.

-Rick

I'd go with a second set of tires for the road. Track tires (at leat the good ones) lose their tread faster than a prom queen loses her dress on prom night.

That said, for road, I love my BFG gForce's. Great price, great grip, and the water doesn't scare them in the turns. I'll be going for another set in a few months. They've worn well.

My buddy that races swears by his Toyos on the track...hard to argue, as he places very well @autocross

Just my humble (unprofessional) opinion.

-Rick

I had similar symtoms on my '01 S without your CELs, I replaced my air filter, MAF, and cleaned the throttle body, would run okay for a awhile, then right back to irratic idle. Tried to find any sign of a vaccum leak using a similar method as you with no success. Car would run rough and idle would bounce between 650 - 1100 RPMs. Just by chance I was hunting for a buried leak when I bumped one of the rubber sleeves ahead of the throttle body. I heard a gaping inhale, come to find my leak was a slit under the clamp that was holding the sleeve on. Ordered a replacement sleeve, installed, and problem solved. Keep searching, could be buried like mine was.

Thanks tXster...

I flooded that engine compartment with as much Propane as I felt comfortable with (read: If the car sparked, it and I would have been spread about a 1 block radius).

Ok, well, not QUITE that much, but there was a clear propane smell all about the driveway.

Revved the engine, thinking the same thing you did---higher revs might open the hole--but nothing happened.

I'm going to go for the MAF for now, and see where that goes. I highly suspect it will fix it. I graphed my pre-cat o2 sensors against each other...they seem to be behaving linearly with respect to each other...at least at the extreme points of operation, so that problem went the way of the dodo (thank God). all that is left is fixing this air mixture issue. As I have *zero* hesitation on the throttle with the MAF unplugged through the entire RPM spectrum, so I'm guessing that we're on to something in that area.

I'll post what happens after I get the MAF.

Thanks again!

-Rick

PS-- There is nothing quite as fun as blowing down the freeway in your Porsche with all the carpeting and rear console gone, and only the heatshield between you and the engine. Love to hear that 3.2 scream....if nothing else, this MAF test was a blast by that experience alone...

yeah, give that a try and let us know how it goes. when i did this to my car, the rough running/bucking/misfiring stopped instantly. it was like the car was brand new. i hope it goes as well for you.

Just out of curiosity, what did you end up doing to fix it permanently?

Thanks,

-Rick

i bought a new MAF. no problems since replacing it.

glad to hear that your car ran well after de-MAFing. just pick up a new MAF and you'll be all set.

i think http://www.autohausaz.com has the lowest MAF prices these days.

Thanks, Chris...it does indeed look like the MAF was it. Expensive part with easy access vs. a cheap part with harder access...oh well :-)

Autohaus does indeed seem to have the best price. I just scoped it out this evening...$247 for the eGas version. Glad that it looks like I finally will have it resolved.

I'll close out this thread once I install the new MAF and verify that it fixes the problem.

-Rick

Unplugged the MAF, reset the DME, and drove it like I stole it.

She runs like a whipped horse (fast and furious--like she should).

The ODB codes that came back after the drive (predictably) were:

P0102 Porsche fault code 115 - Mass air flow sensor below limit value

P0112 Porsche fault code 124 - Intake air temp. sensor below limit value

Sounds about right for an unplugged MAF.

Sitting in the car now. she's idling at a steady 600-650.

Sounds like MAF or wiring then, I take it?

-Rick

yeah, give that a try and let us know how it goes. when i did this to my car, the rough running/bucking/misfiring stopped instantly. it was like the car was brand new. i hope it goes as well for you.

Just out of curiosity, what did you end up doing to fix it permanently?

Thanks,

-Rick

Well, I've scanned the forums for specific help on this, and while I've found some topics that were close, nothing really has lead to a conclusive "AH-HA!"

I have a MY 2000 3.2 Boxster S, which is exhibiting the following behavior.

Symptoms:

1. Rough “starting idle” – Car occasionally has a “bouncing idle” on cold start (650-1100 RPM)

2. Throttle hesitation – Push the pedal, you get a kick, then a brief fade, then another kick that stays there. It’s like the throttle fades for a fraction of a second, then kicks back in.

3. Persistant CEL (no surprise there)

Diagnostics:

I hooked up the car to my Durametric several times. I consistently get

P1126 Porsche fault code 356 - Multiplic. mixture adapt. lower load range B.1:

P1133 Porsche fault code 358 - Multiplic. mixture adapt.lower load range B.2:

Along with the above codes, I usually get one of the following two codes, but *never both at the same time*:

P0102 Porsche fault code 115 – Mass air flow sensor below limit value

P0107 Porsche fault code 299 - Ambient pressure sensor below limit value

What is happening feels like a vacuum leak. Last night I ran the engine and probed around with propane which should increase RPMs if it’s sucked into anything on the inlet side. I probed the vacuum line, oil separator, and all the major lines on the inlet manifolds.

Nothing.

I’ve also disconnected battery, and cleaned the MAF. Seemed better for a while, but the behavior came back.

The only thing I haven’t done yet is to disconnect the MAF, reset the DME, and drive the car around for a while to see if it behaves better. I intend on doing that on my lunch break today.

The question is, has anyone else ever seen this? Any suggestions on direction?

I don’t mind buying a MAF, but I don’t want to buy it and find that I never needed it to begin with…

If my understanding of what others have done here is right, I most likely have a bad MAF. The oddball is that P0107 code that the bad MAF code alternates with, which, so I’m told, may mean my DME is bad.

The car definitely acts like there is an issue with getting too much air (similar to when my vacuum bleeder line had a hole worn in it by the airbox), but I’ll be damned if I can find a leak anywhere…

Thanks guys.

-Rick

Thanks again. Just ordered all the parts I needed online. Looks like a project is set for next w/e!

-R.

http://www.renntech.org/forums/index.php?s...ost&p=43454

Gracias, Loren. Looks like I may just make it this time...

-Rick