A34735

Oops..! B)

http://stuttcars.com/technical/option-codes/997.1/

This site has a complete list of option codes. I can't see how to convert this to a pdf on my ipad (intuitive on my old PC!)

FWIW, an awful lot related to leather trim,

I found the same when I swapped my 996 for a 997. Dealer said the key in door cabrio retract was deleted for the 997. I can't remember why....

I'm embarassed to show only 16K on my 2007 C2S. But that's 5K more than when I got it 3 months ago.

You may not be. Now, I owned a 1999 C2 for two years so I feel qualified to have this discussion.

The transmissions are not as good. There is more drive lash and shifting in and out of 1st and second gears can be notchy, sticky or whatever especially when cold. But, I would NEVER drive a Tiptronic. I'm a manual guy. I have learned to deal with it. Use Miller's EE 75W 90 Nanodrive transmission oil and things will improve a bit.

It's horses for courses, I guess - but if you have NEVER driven one, not sure how you can judge...

I have been a 911 guy since....1968. If you think those other headlights look better you need another drink. Round headlights are it. NOTHING ELSE will do on a 911 and that is why 966 cars are worth less and Porsche, with it's tail between it's legs went right back to round lights.

I actually agree the rounds look more sympathetic, but if the 996 and 997 were to same scale and windscreen slope, I'd put momey on the 996 having a lower CD (yes I know the actual numbers the 996 is 0.30 and the 997 is 0.29).

You need new tires. If you think a 996 car handles near as well you either can't drive or you have bad tires. Get Michelin Super Sports have them expertly balanced and ROCK AND ROLL. I have my car in and out of 4 well drifts all the time. It is SO easy in the 997 S.

It came with brand new Bridgestones, but your point is well taken. Will get the Super Sports at the next replacement. I can't be bothered to deal with the '...either you can't drive or....' other than another option might indeed be a crap transmission (design or my particular unit).

Ditch the PCM. Get an Alpine or Kenwood Nav, a NAV TV most head unit replacement module, a mount kit for the 997 and you will have what looks like a factory system with the best NAV, Bluetooth, iPod integration and better sound. That version of PCM is Becker

trash. (I think Becker?) Talking about learning as you go.

Agreed

The gauges are wonderful. Your dealer is full of crap. You are good to go when your oil temp is over 200. The pistons, heads and upper block may be warm when the water temp gets to 175 but the rest of the engine (crank bearings) is not. Just don't horse it until the oil temp is up. Which means drive like your grandmother. (Actually, my grandmother was hell on wheels)

My dealer service manager is a veteran P guy (Gunther at Porsche of Fremont) I trust implicitly, so I doubt he's full of crap. But I have ignored his blessing and keep the revs below 4K till the oil is hot. But if oil temp is what really matters, ditch the water temp gauge and bring back volts. Having oil temp and pressure close would also be better ergonomics...

JFP, what is the reasoning behind removing the IMS bearing seal?

As the bearing cannot easily be upgraded, removing the rear seal will allow continuous splash lubrication by the sump oil, eliminating the "trapped oil breakdown" pathway to bearing failure. We have several customers running this way with no problems.

Hi JFP in PA,

I believe my engine has the IMS version that requires splitting the case to access it. Can you say if just prising off the cover (to allow splash lube) is a realistic option for me?

As always, with thanks in advance,

Nigel

Yes, but it requires doing nearly all the work required to do an IMS bearing swap on an earlier car. While the bearing cannot be removed without a total engine tear down, once the flywheel is removed you can easily access the IMS flange cover (you still need to lock the engine at TDC and lock the cams as though you were doing an IMS upgrade before removing the IMS flange cover), and then using a tool like a dental pick just pry out the IMS bearings rear seal (it is flexible, so you can get it out without problems). Then button everything back up.

Thx JFP

My first Porsche was a 1999 C2 cabrio, 300 hp, bought in 2010 with 64K miles for $24.5K. It was just the base model, came with a lovely matching hard-top. And though 11 years old it was immaculate, inside and out, full dealer service history. In fact smelt and sounded 'newer' than most new cars. For 3 yrs it was my 90 miles/day commuter car: the thought of driving it helped get me out of bed at 545am, really!

Then at 115K I had a mishap avoiding a deer, and wrote the car off. I topped up the insurance payment ($21.5K, thank you State Farm!) and got a 2007 997.1 C2S 6-speed manual cabrio, 11.5K miles, with the Sports pack (so 355 hp).

I loved it at first, thought it was an incremental improvement over the 996, but now, 4,500 miles later I'm not so sure.

What's obviously better?

Interior. I thought the full leather interior of my 996 was pretty darn good, but the stitching on the 997 is like a Prada handbag - it's Rolls Royce vs Jeep. The headlights are the same story - good just got better! Ditto the ragtop, seats (heated, with the top down at 0C/32F - wonderful!). Engine sounds on start up (throaty burble, with some water on the lungs; transforms to the growling purr of a cat chasing a bird; then onto a sinfonic roar). I like the tire pressure monitoring system, still not sure if I fully trust it though. Truly amazing is the cabin comfortableness with the top down. When it's freezing, a thick jacket is all I need if the seat heater is on and the cabin temp is set suitably high - say 80F/27C. That much of the improvement comes from the mesh screen device (which was missing from my 996) was proved by not using it one morning - i was deeply cold after the 1hr drive to work.

Exterior. Well, the return to round headlights makes purist sense - though I prefer the more slippery 996 profile and front end. And it looks wonderful, big fat tires, flawless deep blue paint, better profile with hood up (and a better hood) - I always pause to admire it for a second or two before climbing in.

What's not to like?

Well - and I'm sure I'll be accused of either incompetence or heresy or both for this: the 6 speed transmission is ****e! After having the dealer install the short shift kit, it was subjectively maybe a little better. But N to 1st often needs a throttle blip to allow the teeth to engage at all. I find I'm only doing seamless 1st to 2nds about 50% of the time. 2-3, 3-4, 4-3 are great, the downshifts being gratifyingly better with double declutching (sounds like dopplekoppling, eh Heinz?). But 3-2 can be hit or miss. 5 and 6 are fine, but pretty redundant for city driving. I think it better as a 4+2 than a 6, if that makes sense. But in all honesty, every other manual I've driven (which I did exclusively for my first 22 driving years) was easier to shift, up or down. (The clutch, BTW, is fine).

The only other negatives are i) PCM/phone system (which I'll replace) - just totally lame. ii) I miss the volts on the gauges. I'm confused by oil vs water temp: the dealer says it's good to go if the water is at 175, even if the oil temp hasn't changed. That just doesn't seem right to my simple mind! iii) I want a dipstick, was very surprised to learn it was abandoned for the 997 onwards.

My final impression is that the 997.1 is yet another incremental engineering triumph over it's predecessor. The performance, reliability, fit and finish, luxuriousness are so obviously much better, it's a wonderful drive but....it's bigger, feels heavier. The 996 is noticeably smaller and though 11 lbs/hp vs 10 lbs/hp, it seemed just...tighter. I liked keeping both hands on the wheel, loved the Tiptronic both in rush hour and in the hills.

So, after 3 months I'm seriously wondering whether I'm the right person for this car...

JFP, what is the reasoning behind removing the IMS bearing seal?

As the bearing cannot easily be upgraded, removing the rear seal will allow continuous splash lubrication by the sump oil, eliminating the "trapped oil breakdown" pathway to bearing failure. We have several customers running this way with no problems.

Hi JFP in PA,

I believe my engine has the IMS version that requires splitting the case to access it. Can you say if just prising off the cover (to allow splash lube) is a realistic option for me?

As always, with thanks in advance,

Nigel

I just picked up a stock GT3 with only 8500 miles, I noticed this droning noise only at 2800 to 3000 rpm, also sounds like a buzz and don't recall hearing it the times I drove in my friends 996 GT3. I looked in the service records I got from the prior owner and he complained to Porsche about it when the car was almost new and they told him that it was normal for this model. Can anyone else confirm or deny this?

Thank you.

Isn't this a well-known 'issue' for GT3s? I'm sure I heard there's a cable in the driver door that harmonizes around 3000 rpm (I think it was most pronounced at 3300 rpm). BTW I'm a 996/997.1 driver, so a large sack of salt might be advisable!

JFP, Silver TT and Spiffyjiff,

Thanks for your answers - I'm reassured the dealer likely didn't mess with the logs!

And another question: I've a persistent 'C102 Seat Memory CAN Single Wire (Comfort)' error code? (This is a 2007 997.1 C2S cabrio). Which might be something real, as the seat memory buttons don't seem to behave the same as they did on my old 996 (even after reading the manual)

With thanks in advance,

Nigel

Thanks again JFP.

If memory serves (I'm away from the shop at the moment), the C102 may indicate that a controller needs to be reset or possibly replaced. This cannot be done with the Durametric, it needs a PIWIS.

JFP, Silver TT and Spiffyjiff,

Thanks for your answers - I'm reassured the dealer likely didn't mess with the logs!

And another question: I've a persistent 'C102 Seat Memory CAN Single Wire (Comfort)' error code? (This is a 2007 997.1 C2S cabrio). Which might be something real, as the seat memory buttons don't seem to behave the same as they did on my old 996 (even after reading the manual)

With thanks in advance,

Nigel

My Enthusiast Durametic cable arrived last night: I wanted to check the over rev history, if there was any.

Surprisingly (to me at least!), IR1 and IR2 had a few events, but nothing in IR3-IR6.

The car is a 2007 997.1 C2S cabrio, had 11,400 mileson it when I got it a month ago.

Questions are:

1 is no over revs in IR3-IR6 suspicious of someone having gone in and cleaned up the log file? (This came from a P-dealer whom I don't fully trust...)

2 any ideas where I can find a PDF list of all the codes and some idea of how to interpret them?

As always, with thanks in advance,

Nigel

Thx Richard!

Hoping someone out there knows the answer to this one. I'm the lucky new owner of a 997 C2S cabrio, without satnav, with Sport Chrono Plus package. Though I can find references to ability to change some functions (like the lights off delay), can't for the life of me find the menu tree for these preferences. Is there an ALT-CNTRL-SHFT-DEL equivalent I need to know about? With thanks in advance...Nigel

Hi,

Brought my '06 C2S to the dealer and asked if a newer NAV DVD was available. The DVD I had was labeled:

04.2005

997.642.257.02

7L5.919.859.AC

Got a call the first day saying they were having some trouble with it and that they were talking to Porsche. Three days later I get a call telling me that my PCM has become "locked up" while they were doing a software upgrade necessary to use the newer NAV data DVD, and that it needs to be replaced, and that it's my responsibility - $4600!

It's out of an extended warranty but it seems pretty crazy that I can bring in a working PCM that they brick with their own software. To my knowledge it's the original unit that came with the car.

The PCM software in place when I brought it in was 05024CD1/3905

Which software upgrade was the appropriate one for them to attempt? Is there something I can try that they may not have thought of?

thanks

Kevin

This wasn't In Livermore, CA was it? Sounded eerily similar to my experience: won a free valet at a PCA event. When I picked the car up the OBC was fried: they wanted $3700 to fix it! I got PCNA involved, and it was eventually resolved satisfactorily.

Nice score. Color? Options? 6 speed? Let's hear it!!

These are beautiful cars!

Thanks for all your good replies. Turned out I found a 2007 Cabrio S with only 11,000miles. CPO'ed for another 18 months, and I added a warranty for 6 years/100K....so feeling good.

Amazing improvement of the 2007 Cabrio C2S over the 1999 Cabrio C2...

And thanks again for all the good advice,

Nigel

Hi there,

I totalled my 996 (avoiding a deer) on Monday, have just been to see a lovely 997.1 C4 Manual Cabriolet as potential replacement. It's 2006, has only 15000 miles on it. The local Porsche dealer gave it a clean PPI, looks like new to me.

Are there any issues with such a low mileage car? Should I consider the L&N IMS retrofit?

I'm guessing my 996 hard-top won't fit on the 997....can anyone confirm?

All advice will be much appreciated.

With thanks in advance,

Nigel

I'm glad I read this after I got my 996! It's a 1999, 63K miles, one owner since new. All scheduled services, including the belt, completed. Since I got it I've added 4K in 4 months (to and from work is a 90 mile round trip). Considering it's 11 years old, it feels like a new car (touch wood!): The oil is still so clear I have trouble seeing it on the dipstick...I never want to drive anything else!Of course...if I find myself on the side of the road with a $20K bill, I'll let you know!Added 20 Apr 2011.Mileage now 73K (so I've added 10K since Sep 2011, about 9miles/day). Tracked it once, changed the oil 3X. Of 5 experts (2 Porsche dealers, 3 independent shops) 3/4 unuequivocally said don't worry, one said change it now. It purrs smoothly, hisses and whirs for 5 mins on cold mornings.I add an update when I get up to 83K....but I have relaxed my guard a little lit....We shall seee....

Well I actually logged on to Renntech because I'm having a problem with a window regulator on my 2000 996 C2 Cabriolet on which I am the second owner. I'm also the orginal owner of a 99 Boxster. But I happened on to this thread and just had to post.

I'm ALWAYs having some problems with my cars. Read on below if you want to know my personal favorites. That said, these two cars are without a doubt the very BEST cars I have ever owned in terms of driving AND MAINTENANCE. I have 146,000 miles on the Boxster. It sill has the ORIGINAL clutch! It still runs STRONG! And while I have done quite a bit of maintenance on it over the years... new water pump, new coolant reservoir, new serpentine rollers, new starter... these are what I consider normal wear and tear things. I have done NO major maintenance on the engine. And I have to say that the car has been pretty parsimonious on tires and brakes. I would go through three sets of tires and rotors on my wifes Audi A6 for every ONE set I put on the Boxster.

And my experience with my 911 is pretty similar. I now have 86,000 miles on it. It also has the original clutch. I did replace the RMS one time and I replaced the air mass meter recently. Other than that, ZERO engine maintenance. And I'm only on my second set of brakes!

Now, I imagine most of you are thinking... "well, he babies his cars." Not true. In fact, I drive them hard and even worse, post divorce, I'm now relegated to parking them outside most of the time!!! But they continue to be rock solid. I just have to wash them more often.

It's true that the IMS shaft failures tend to be catastrophic and therefore very dramatic and traumatic for their owners, but fearing to own a 986/996 and even worse slandering the car is simply not justified. The vast majority of 986/996s, probably 95% still on the road have their original engines intact and are still providing red line thrills for owners who appreciate them for the truly magnificent cars they are.

I've had a slew of other cars and motorcycles... everything from a 57 supercharged Studebaker Golden Hawk, Norton 750cc Combat Commando, 65 356SC, 68 Hemi Roadrunner, 68 Mustang 302 Toploader, etc. the list goes on and on. Many of them I worked on myself, when it was still possible to work on cars w/o being a computer geek. And I will never drive anything again but a Porsche. In my opinion, for the money, they are simply the best automobiles in the world. And I have found them to be very reasonable in terms of maintenance and upkeep,

Now do they have problems... Absolutely! Is the Porsche factory upfront about them. Not so much... For me, the most annoying and recalcitrant problems have been the ubiquitous airbag and check engine light problems in the Boxster which are both more or less Porsche factory design defects. I think most in this forum know both problems well. The wiring harness for the airbag/seatbelt safety system in early 986/996 cars was simply deficient. Porsche has come out with many TSBs and fixes but none of them is bulletproof as those with early 986s know. And the check engine light problem is really one of insufficient and innaccurate diagnostics. I along with many others have ended up replacing O2 sensors and air mass meters (because the PST reported them as the problem) when often as not the problem is really related to the oil separator system which Porsche dealers really don't like working on because the parts cost nothing but the effort involved in diagnosing and fixing the problem is nasty.

So, I for one would like to sing the praises of the 986/996. Great cars... I'm a proud owner of mine and plan on keeping them for as long they'll have me. Now back to getting that **** regulator and passenger window working right... It's part of the glory right?

Steve

2000 C2 Cabriolet

1999 Boxster

65 356SC (unfortunately deceased)

Touch wood...echoes my experience. My 13 year old 996 feels newer/tighter than any other car I've had. Sure it costs a bit more to maintain, but I, like Steve, seem to have been lucky so far. Or maybe not luck, just those Germans really do know how to make cars...

Ive added 10K to the '63K on it when bought in Sep 2011. Changed the oil 3 X since then. Still seems to running very well. Blackstone oil report came back clean, but dealer thinks water tank is leaking - levels haven't changed to my eys, nor has temperature increased... Will post again if and when I get to 83K...

I'm now lulled into a sense of security (4/5 experts - Porsche Dealers, independent repair shops - have advised they wouldn't do the IMS upgrade to their own cars at similar timepoints, mileages. So I'm going to keep plugging away...

PS my missus called me a 'race-car driving, skydiving, scuba-diving-alcholic-drug-addicted boy friend with a death wish' - Nicest thing she'd said in years. Thank you sweetie!

She sounds special... :clapping:

Even after 27 years together, she certainly is! :thankyou:

Now 16 months later, I'm at 91,000 miles.

At 75K I bit the bullet and had the L&N IMS upgrade installed (by Porsche of Fremont, who I trust completely. Unlike another local rascal...). They also replaced the RMS and a couple of other parts that could only be done with the engine out.

But hand on crotch (touch wood!) the car is still purring like a Swiss sewing machine. I drive as fast as I can whenever it's safe to do so (which is not often, I have no wish to endanger fellow road-users). Typically I will do 100-105/mph once a week, 105-130 mph once every 6 weeks and >150mph mabye once every 8 months). But it certainly gets redlined several times every day (I do 450 miles/week). I get the Mobil 1 oil changed and tested every 7.5K: the Blackstone labs reports are always perfect (and BTW, there was nothing wrong with the original IMS bearing).

I guess what I've learnt is owning a 911 is not the same as a Toyota Corolla. Whilst I'd have trouble justifying $120K on a new one, I don't have any trouble budgeting $5K/year for tires, brakes, rotors, oil etc...In exchange I've got a really nice car that cost the same as my Subaru Outback and is only 0.4seconds slower than comparable 2012 models. Thus far I estimate it's cost me about $1/mile, excluding gas. Mileage is about 20/gallon vs about 30/gallon for a boring 4 door saloon. I spend a little more than I need to everyday, but I never have trouble getting out of bed to go to work in the morning!

Ive added 10K to the '63K on it when bought in Sep 2011. Changed the oil 3 X since then. Still seems to running very well. Blackstone oil report came back clean, but dealer thinks water tank is leaking - levels haven't changed to my eys, nor has temperature increased... Will post again if and when I get to 83K...

I'm now lulled into a sense of security (4/5 experts - Porsche Dealers, independent repair shops - have advised they wouldn't do the IMS upgrade to their own cars at similar timepoints, mileages. So I'm going to keep plugging away...

PS my missus called me a 'race-car driving, skydiving, alcholic drug addict boy friend with a death wish' - Nicest thing she'd said in years. Thank you sweetie!

(as the idiot who lost a bit of plastic tubing in the engine)...I'd go with the 'do not drive' recommendation. The tow cost can be claimed from your insurer.

Whatever the ultimate cause, driving this one to the garage is only likely to make it worse...take the tow!

Thank you everyone...especially 'JFP in PA'

Had the car towed to Kahler's. They put a scope down the dipstick tube, couldn't see the missing piece. Dropped the pan, and got it!

I felt (and am) stupid, but felt better once I got behind the wheel to drive home.

Moral of this story? A good chunk of my maintenance expenses have are self-induced. I'm going to stop worrying and stick to driving.

Will post the Blackstone results when they're back.

Thanks again..... :D

Folks,

I've lost a piece of plastic tube in the oil system. Here's why and how...

Why? My 996 is 12 years old, I worry about the IMS. I heard having the oil tested might reveal early wear of the IMS bearings (elevated copper, I think). So I ordered a test kit from Blackstone

How?

The Blackstone kit needs about 3oz/100mL. If the oil isn't collected during a change, they suggest poking a tube down the dipstick holder, and aspirating the oil with a syringe.

I got the tube in about 2.5 feet, then felt some resistance: but I managed to push through, and get some oil out.

But: when I withdrew the tube, the last 1 inch was shredded, with 1.0 X 0.2 inch piece clearly missing.

My questions are:

Q1: Is the area I tested upstream from the filter? In which case I expect the filter will do it's job and catch this piece of plastic. No worries.

Q2: If not, then there's a piece of soft plastic (25mm X 5mm) circulating with the oil. Is this likely to block anything critical - and thence cause localized meltdown?

Any help will be welcome!..

With thanks in advance,

Nigel