1schoir

I just ordered a Robbins Top on ebay for $650. I decided to stay with black and have the smaller glass window option. I know that the top will not stay in "service mode" by itself anymore so I will try and order the strap that Robbins makes to keep the top in service mode (PN 3162 STRAP).

I went for the glass because of better visibility but also because I can tint it to match my side windows which I tinted last weekend. Hope that helps.

Honda:

Check out Mike Focke's Boxster Pages for excellent DIY instructions on replacing the top, with loads of photos at: http://mike.focke.googlepages.com/replacingthetop-adiy

So that you don't get delayed once you start, be sure to buy the two clamping rails ahead of time. The plastic ears into which the little black pins push into almost always break when taking them apart. They're relatively cheap (about $12.00 each) and you can always return them if you don't break the original ones.

If you run into any roadblocks, shoot me a PM, or post here and I'll provide you with any help I can.

Regards, Maurice.

Today when I started the 986 the batt idiot light stayed on while I drove away. I stopped and reastarted the engine and it was normal again. Later the same night the oil pressure light did the same thing, and again it was out when I restarted the engine. I have ample oil.

Any ideas?

Bob:

I agree, it sounds like the beginning of a failing ignition switch.

I got two oem switches (one spare because of all the stories here and elsewhere) from FCP Groton for $32.00 total, shipped. Number is (860) 445-7340, ask for "Scott".

Regards, Maurice.

PK:

I believe that the "sensors" by the rearview mirror are sensors for movement inside the cabin when the alarm is on.

My key only has two remote functions, one to arm and disarm the alarm/locks, and the other to remotely open the rear trunk lid.

The problem with these superchargers and a lot of aftermarket kits is that the makers of these kits won't admit or inform you up front that "minor" modifications or bending might be necessary. I'm sure you'll get it sorted out eventually and your knuckles will heal a little faster when you hear the whirring of the supercharger.

As far as the top, I did replace the B-pillar microswitch (along with almost everything else) so I'm not so sure that that is where the problem lies. I think some of the answer may lie in that hard to decipher table that is on page 61-6 of the Bentley manual.

Let us know when the SC is done and we'll get to the "bottom" of the top mystery eventually. Maybe JPorter will stumble onto this thread and enlighten us all.

Regards, Maurice.

Hey Marice,

I’m further waylaid by my starter problem (I think you’ve added your 2 cents somewhere). Funny, all I’d done was change the plugs and taken of a filter box duct (plus hung the sc on the motor, (no connections made though)). To make matters more comical, this whole odyssey started with a decision to refinish my wheels (then since the cars up & level, how bout change the gear oil, need a special torx socket for that, & hey, low and behold, there’s the bracket for the blower I started to install 2 years ago, lets reignite that flame, need new plugs for that...etc, etc).

Tell me more about table on “61-6 of the Bentley manual”. What does it cover? I’ve wanted that manual but have been spending money willy-nilly while this project(s) spins out of control. Not in the budget

One thing that might fit into the top equation, maybe, would be some interface to the computer under the drivers seat, might entail some programming by someone with a Porsche PS….bla bla tool. That computer has tentacles into a number of areas you wouldn’t expect, top might be one. I had mine (computer) replaced while the top mechanism was a mess…inoperable. Would explain my problem but not really yours in that yours is working halfway now through brute force.

One thing I’ curios about; when your top goes down and stops itself, I seem to recall reading somewhere that the clamshell actually delays shutting off after the switch is tripped, for a second, to cinch down the clamshell down. Do you se any evidence of that happening?

I just got to take a look at the wiring diagrams a bit, read some voltages, etc. Problem is, a lot of those wires disappear into the relay/controller with no explanation as to the logic in there, so I’m only guardedly optimistic that I’ll find the silver bullet.

Anyway thanks,

Peter

Peter:

What you describe as your "odyssey" is a well-known phenomenon in gearhead circles, and it is affectionately known as the "mightaswell syndrome". It goes something like this...you take one broken part to work on it, and then you start thinking, well, as long as I have easier access to this other part, I might as well... You get the idea. One good thing is that it signals that you are perfectly normal. LOL!!! Although, I have been down that road so many times that those who know me well would argue that point strenuously.

Don't get discouraged, especially not by the starter problem. It's sounding more and more like a bad, loose or corroded connection problem. Just keep thinking what the car will feel like when you get it all back together.

With respect to the convertible top idiot light saga, there is a poster named "jporter" who has explored what is known as the "after-running time" of the convertible top motor once the clamshell microswitch is tripped. Tool Pants also shed some light on that issue in one of his posts, where he described an old-time german mechanic who used a spring glued onto the underside of the clamshell to trip the microswitch a split second sooner. jporter's solution was more involved, and in the end he concluded that he might have been able to solve his original problem by first tightening down the nuts that hold the black plastic cover on top of the transmission where the wormgear that is turned by the cable is located.

I don't think the alarm unit under the seat is related. This past weekend I installed the kits to correct the airbag light problem and I became pretty familiar with all of the wires down there.

In my case, as I stated, there was a cycling back and forth of the clamshell at the very end of its travel towards closing with one of the thicknesses of styrofam blocks that I tried. It's a little too cold in New York for the vinyl window the last couple of days, but as soon as we get a sunny, warmer day, I will go out and analyze that and report back.

Even though I replaced my canvas top recently, I'm being careful with the vinyl window.

I am attaching a photo of the chart that I mentioned from the Bentley manual. Bentley got it from the Porsche Factory Manual. Maybe when you study it, something will make sense to you there, although, with what you have going on with your supercharger install, it may be a little taxing.

If the photo is not clear enough, let me know and I will scan it in.

Let me know if any "lights" go off!

Regards, Maurice.

P.K.:

Some progress on determining how the "top open" light on the dashboard is turned on and off...

Yesterday, after reading and re-reading some of the posts from a couple of years ago by JPorter, Tool Pants and others, and reading a recent comment from Stefan to one of your posts, I went outside and started to "play" with my top again to see if I could transfer some of the knowledge of the aforementioned posters to my top. Some kind of "osmosis", I was imagining.... still have to reset the clock.)

As you said, I would like for my top to "be all that it can be", and I'm not quite there yet, but I think we have made some progress.

Regards, Maurice.

Thanks Maurice, sounds like you hit on another piece to the puzzle, I always thought the rear switch with the big arm on it seemed like an awful big target to miss, and, as you said, it doesn’t take much to trip the switch. So I never bothered with it, guess I ought to revisit it.

As to the up position, gotta have something to do with the b pillar switch and whatever circuitry goes along with it, or at least it works in conjunction with something else…wonder if those “sensors” by the rearview mirror come into play for some reason (never understood what they were there for)

Still fiddling with my Super charger. Wrestled and wrestled with it till learned in a very mater of fact way that despite TPC protestations to the contrary, installers regularly hack and mod the thing to make them fit and work. I really thought there was something wrong with my car. Turns out to be a somewhat poor design with poor execution. My car and I aren’t to blame for my bleeding knuckles

BTW, do you have a remote on your key for the top, I do and it doesn’t do anything either. Hope when the normal functions are sorted out, the remote will fall into line…

Regards, PK

P.S. Ill get to gandering at those wiring diagrams for the top as soon as I get the SC square.

PK:

I believe that the "sensors" by the rearview mirror are sensors for movement inside the cabin when the alarm is on.

My key only has two remote functions, one to arm and disarm the alarm/locks, and the other to remotely open the rear trunk lid.

The problem with these superchargers and a lot of aftermarket kits is that the makers of these kits won't admit or inform you up front that "minor" modifications or bending might be necessary. I'm sure you'll get it sorted out eventually and your knuckles will heal a little faster when you hear the whirring of the supercharger.

As far as the top, I did replace the B-pillar microswitch (along with almost everything else) so I'm not so sure that that is where the problem lies. I think some of the answer may lie in that hard to decipher table that is on page 61-6 of the Bentley manual.

Let us know when the SC is done and we'll get to the "bottom" of the top mystery eventually. Maybe JPorter will stumble onto this thread and enlighten us all.

Regards, Maurice.

My went on about a month ago. A friend was trying to get porsche to do a good will. no luck!! Ok the car is old but what does age have to do with rewiring an electical safety device..

The honest dealer wanted 9 hours labor and about 350 in parts. So for that price I am looking for a used set of sport seats that still have the buckles..

RDSII:

Make sure those sport seats have the updated buckles. Part numbers are 996.803.183.09 Driver's Side and 996.803.183.10 Psgr's side.

If you follow the seat belt buckles' electric lead to under the seats, the driver's side lead will terminate in a square blue 4 pronged connector that is housed in the outermost position within the seat plug connection. The passenger's side lead is green.

Regards, Maurice.

Good Grief. There has to be a better way. I just went to the dealer again, who said bring in the car for the second buckle, no mention of TSB or warranty. If we are faced with this daunting task, isn't that quite the engineering marvel by engineers? If we have to go through that procedure, who would even want the airbag system? Thanks for a depressing post.

Didn't mean to depress you. Just wanted you to know what you were up against if you went to the dealer again.

The obvious reason why we put up with this kind of engineering abuse (and there are others that I won't mention here, but you know what they are) is because of all of the other inimitable qualities of the car.

Regards, Maurice.

I was wondering if someone out there might have experienced the same problem. Yesterday, I replaced coolant tank, spark plugs, and also changed the oil on my 98 Boxster (manual). However, when I started the car up, it started shaking a little. I then drove it around the block and the check engine light came on. The car started shaking and then shut down. The car does start up but I'm afraid to drive it to an auto store to get a diagnostic. Also, inside the car, when I get ready to start the engine, it makes a low spinning noise (like a dvd changer looking for a disk).

I think it has something to do with the factory NGK spark plugs I installed. I can't imagine it has to do with the oil change or the coolant tank. I did notice one of the Spark Plug Socket Connectors was slightly torn. Could this be the problem? If so, should I change out all 6? If this does fix the problem, will the check engine light automatically turn off? Appreciate the help. Thanks.

If you fix the problem, the easiest way to turn off the Check Engine Light is to disconnect the battery negative cable for 1 minute (BE SURE YOU HAVE YOUR RADIO CODE FIRST) and then reconnect it.

Best not to do this until AFTER you have had the codes read, so that you will know exactly what the fault is.

Regards, Maurice.

I saw the wheels Carrera Mike had made up by CCW wheels in Florida. I really liked them so I ordered a set from John. You won't find a more helpful or informative guy when it comes to wheels and tires. He offered to sell me the tires for the Tire Rack price and send me a complete set of wheels and tires...already balanced with center caps ready to just bolt on.

I ended up ordering a set of the T10...which have fewer spokes and let the rotors show through...also a lot easier to keep clean. John put them on a Southwest airplane and had them to me within one day after they were completed. That's service with a smile!!

I stayed with the 18 inch for a number of reasons....and the tires are Michelin Pilot Sports..... sizes are backs: 315/30/18 and fronts: 235/40/18. They look great...and give the car a more aggressive look.

For those who will say that they look too "blingy"....I like them that way....and no, I wouldn't consider going with the black centers.

Hopefully the picture will come thru....I'm not very good at this photo stuff.

chuck

Chuck:

I disagree. You are actually pretty good at this photo stuff. Your car, in the second photo, looks like it's about to take off!!!

Oh, and you are really, really good at turning a disaster into a beautiful positive.

Enjoy your new wheels (both the car and and the rims), and use them in good health!

Regards, Maurice.

Hello,

My top open indicator light, according to the manual is your signal to let got of the button and thus stop the top movment in it’s tracks. Someone here stated that there’s stops when the light goes on. Would this be an improvement on later models? It seem completely logical: If a signal from the microswitches can turn the light on and off, it sure as heck could stop the top.

If it is indeed a function on later models (mines a 99). Could I fit mine with a later model double relay/controller to get that function? Any body heard of a circuit “hack” to do it? I can’t think of why it wouldn’t have been done in the first place. It seems a slight jiggering of wires would do it…put the user out of the cycle.

Regards, P.K.

P.K.:

Some progress on determining how the "top open" light on the dashboard is turned on and off...

Yesterday, after reading and re-reading some of the posts from a couple of years ago by JPorter, Tool Pants and others, and reading a recent comment from Stefan to one of your posts, I went outside and started to "play" with my top again to see if I could transfer some of the knowledge of the aforementioned posters to my top. Some kind of "osmosis", I was imagining.

Anyway, I cycled my top up and down a couple of times and I was able to see that, near the end of the "top up" travel, when it was almost closed and the clamshell was closing down tight, the underside of the clamshell was NOT contacting the small black crooked lever that operates the clamshell microswitch. I was able to see this from inside the car by looking under the roll bar and holding up (out of the way) the vinyl "skirt" that normally hooks onto the two black plastic tabs on either side of the rearmost vertical surface under the clamshell.

On the reverse cycle, i.e., when the top was fully opened and the clamshell was closing down tight on top of it, I could not see as well whether or not it was making contact and depressing that lever to activate the microswitch.

To get the clamshell to go down further (tighter down), I screwed in the two 32mm painted (plastic) hexagon-shaped receptacles that accept the two cone shaped rubber parts that are fastened to the underside of either side of the clamshell on its rearmost edge. That aligned the clamshell a little better with the surface of the car's quarter panels, but now it was just about making contact.

The clamshell microswitch is tripped almost as soon as the crooked black lever is pressed down (i.e., at the very beginning of its travel downwards).

Next, I taped a 1/2" thick piece of styrofam to the underside of the clamshell (there is a small raised "bump" where the microswitch lever arm is supposed to make contact) and now, when I raised the top completely, I could see that the microswitch lever arm was being depressed by the clamshell as it was shutting down tight.

Now, I pressed my top button to open the top completely and, after the clamshell closed down tight, the "top open" light on the dashboard went out AND the motor stopped operating. EUREKA!!! Pressing the top button in the open direction (on the left side of the button) would now not operate the top. Pressing the top button in the closed direction now activated the motor, lit up the warning light and sent the top on its way to the closed position.

Unfortunately, for some reason, when the top reached its completely closed position and the clamshell closed down tight, the warning light would NOT turn off on that end.

BTW, in the course of trying the various adjustments (screwing in the receptacles, taping on 1/2 inch styrofoam piece, trying 1" inch thick piece, etc.) I noticed that at times, either with the top all the way up OR all the way down, the clamshell would cycle up and down in a loop for about a two inch travel from completely shut tight to slightly ajar and keep going back and forth with the button pushed in the open mode (with the top completely open) or with the button pushed in the closed mode (with the top completely closed).

I also noticed that what actually trips the warning light on when it is off is the actual initial pushing of the button. When you push the button, the warning light goes on instantaneously, with no delay whatsoever. I think that what happens next is a combination of signals from the B-pillar microswitch and from the clamshell microswithc is what serves to turn the warning light off, but not positive if it is both, or a combination, or a specific sequence that does it.

So, that is as far as I have gotten. I hope you will be able to use some of this information to figure out exactly how this actually works.

One added benefit of the warning light going out is that, with the top completely open, the windows can be operated all the way up and they will stay all the way up. Before, with the warning light on (even though the top was completely open), the windows would retract down by about 2-3 inches from their completely up position. The major benefit, of course, is that the motor turns off and there isn't excessive pressure on the push rods or the joint arms of the kind that would destroy the plastic cups ($$$$).

(Note: You can always "reset" the warning light [i.e., turn it off] by disconnecting the battery for 10 seconds. If you do it for only 10 seconds, you don't have to re-code the radio, but you still have to reset the clock.)

As you said, I would like for my top to "be all that it can be", and I'm not quite there yet, but I think we have made some progress.

Regards, Maurice.

My airbag light turned on a month ago, I took it to the dealer. His software showed that the driver's side buckle was faulty. I paid them $275 to replace it, apparently they have to remove the seat and do some rewiring. The light went out. For two weeks. :clapping:

The cursed light came back on this week. :cursing: I'm taking it in again. Problem is, the more I read about it, the more it looks like a systemic problem, and people have replaced both buckes, an airbag or two, rewired the module, and still it comes on. I'd hate to think there is a problem with this wiring system that hits cars as old as mine. Is there no answer from Porsche or one of the fine mechanics who know the trick to this annoying little problem in an otherwise finely tuned machine? Apparently, it is something that pops up more than it should. It never happens in my Toyota.

'99 996 C4 coupe

94,000 mi.

Couldn't agree with you more about your Toyota comment. In two different Toyotas (92 Camry and 97 Celica Convertible), with a combined mileage approaching 300K miles, never any hint or sign of an airbag light on my girlfriend's car.

The latest Porsche fix involves replacing both seat belt buckles, splicing and soldering in four leads with "gold plated and greased" contact springs and substituting them for four of the original contact springs in the 8-pin connector under the driver's (left) side seat (positions B5, B6, B7, & B8), doing the same but with only two contact springs on the 8-pin connector under the passenger's (right) side seat (positions B7 & B8), and then splicing and soldering beefier leads with cable lugs in place of thinner leads all leading to a ground point under each seat. After that, you must substitute new plug caps on the the 8-pin connectors, which now include a tab that is used to securely fasten all of the wires exiting the 8-pin connectors with cable ties, and add cable ties to the female 8-pin connectors on the undersides of the seats and you are almost done. It's a straightforward job once you decipher the descriptions and language in the TSB, which is a special chore in itself.

Then you have to reset the airbag light with your Durametric, PST2 or PIWIS and that provides a "permanent" fix.

Not doing both seats (regardless of the specific codes) is just putting off the inevitable, IMHO.

I have been thinking lately of the hundreds of thousands of dollars of revenue that these airbag lights have brought to the dealers, either from the money they collect from Porsche on warranty work or on "paid" work. I also wonder if it's only in the hundreds of thousands of dollars, and not more. This also does not take into account the untold wasted hours spent by Porsche owners in having to get these fixes.

Regards, Maurice.

I have a 1999 Porsche 996 and all of a sudden the passenger side window will not go down that one-inch length when opening and closing the window. The window operation works perfectly though other than that problem. My question is, do I simply need to replace the window regulator or do I need a new motor? Any details would be greatly appreciated.

Rizzo:

The motors rarely go bad in comparison to the frequency of window regulators "stretching" or fraying and needing replacement. What you have described are the classic symptoms of a "stretched" window regulator cable or assembly.

Go to this link for a more detailed discussion and photos: http://www.renntech.org/forums/index.php?s...&hl=1schoir

Although it deals with a 986, it should be the same or very similar for your car. One minor difference is that when you install the new regulator, you need not use the additonal "bump stop" that is usually included with a rivet in a small plastic bag. The 996 uses the lower bump stop (on the front rail of the window regulator only).

Good luck, and let us know how you make out, and what your defective window regulator looked like.

Regards, Maurice.

Thanks very much for the info and great photo.

That is certainly the elusive 3rd one!

Just to clarify...

The microswitch in the photo is the one behind the outer door handle. You can see the small black part (just above the microswitch metal lever) that acts on the microswitch. As the handle is pulled up from the outside, that small black part "rotates" and presses on the switch. That is what causes the 1/2 inch drop of the window when you initially pull on the outer door handle.

There is another similar switch (not shown in the photo) which is mounted on the backside of the door panel and which has a similar effect on the window when the inner door handle is pulled.

To locate the remaining switch, follow along the (green in my '97) plastic cable which you see sort of bent over at the left center of the photo. That cable, which is covered by a black fluted rubber cover as it goes forward to where it is connected to the inner door handle, is the cable that acts on the latch which is on the (rearmost) side of the door to unlock the door. You can see where it leads to sort of vertical (slanted) cylinder with wires coming out of the bottom. The remaining switch is in that location, and that is the one that is tripped by either closing/opening the door, or by closing the latch (2 clicks) as Tool Pants suggested above.

Regards, Maurice.

Thanks Loren

Car is being put back together now and Peter is checking the wiring on the passenger and driver side floor pans. He stated that you can get kit for this but he uses his own fix. Sounds as if it might be linked to other reference I read to grounding problems.

He mentioned that his experience on seat belt reference was to do with the tensioners. Not sure if this is in line with experience from the folks here or not.

Btw where do I get hold of the TIB's that refer to this ?

Tony:

The prevailing wisdom is that the airbag light is caused by a defective/insufficient ground not on the tensioner side, but rather on the seat belt buckle side (female side).

The Technical Service Bulletin that deals with this issue is number 6924, dated 21JUL04. It deals with fault codes 45, 46, 48 and 49.

One way to get access to the TSB's is to become a contributing member of RennTech.org (click on "Quick Menu" above and scroll down to "Current TSB's).

Regards, Maurice.

There must be a micro switch inside the door on the door latch, since there is no pin-type plunger switch like a "normal"car.

Open your door and with a screwdriver close the latch all the way. On my car there is 2 clicks when the latch is closed all the way with a screw driver, and then after about a minute the interior lights go out.

One of the few things I don't have a picture of.....

Tool Pants:

Here is a good photo of one of the (three ?) microswitches inside the door for your files:

Regards, Maurice.

All,

Does anyone know the best way to paint my stainless steel tips and muffler bypass pipes? I want to paint then in a satin black.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Don't do it yourself. Stainless is harder to paint than other metals (also to weld and to plate.) Powedercoat should hold up and is not that expensive, a high temp appliance enamel should also do it. Professionally applied paints are catalized and or cured differently and it's a specialty thing. DIY with caution, experience, and some expensive tools.

There is a pretty good and not too expensive powdercoating kit available from The Eastwood Company. Works great, all you need is a small oven.

Regards, Maurice.

so then would it be easier to take the frame off as well, and then sew in a new one?

btw, anyone make the rear plastic piece tinted, or is just clear available?

Check out eBay. There is someone on there that sells a kit, and he specifically mentions a darker tint available for an additional $10 IIRC.

Regards, Maurice.

Hi Everyone,

Could really do with your help on my Boxster hood problem.

About a year ago, the plastic connection rods for my hood snapped and the hood was all out of sync. I managed to put some new rods in and realign the hood motors by disconnecting the cables and moving them bit by bit till they were well aligned. The hood and clam shell work OK now but there is a problem that was not present before.

When the hood is up and the clam shell down, if I try to open the hood, it just closes harder and gets stuck, I then have to release the brass clips by hand from inside. It goes up and down OK as long as you dont go down far enough and activate the clam shell microswitch.

I thought this was due to the micro switches so I checked them and found and replaced a faulty microswitch that was in the passenger side hood area. But no difference. The only way I can get the hood to work OK, is to artificially tape up the microswitch for the clam (so it thinks it is closed) now the hood goes up and down on request, but when it is down, the windows dont go up all the way (because the windshield microswitch is open the clam one closed, so it thinks I have just pulled the latch and am about to convert).

The brake light switch is fine because the car wont convert until the light is on. The windshield release switch seems to work because the windows go down half way if I release it.

Has anyone had a similar problem and what is the solution please.

Many thanks in advance

AK

AK:

You did not mention whether or not the "top open" warning light stays on in your dashboard. If the light does stay on even if the convertible top (what you are calling the "hood") is fully closed or fully open, then you will not be able to completely close your windows. The only way the windows will go all the way up and stay up is by artificially keeping the windshield microswitch depressed. Not very practical.

As far as your V-levers only spinning in one direction when the top is completely closed and the clamshell is all the way down and snug, there is a way to reverse the direction of the V-levers as a temporary measure. Since your car is a '99, and judging from your description of what you have replaced, I am going to assume that you have a B-pillar microswitch under the LEFT side B-Pillar microswitch. If you take a small allen key or use a small piece of wire to lasso same around the small metal lever part of the B-pillar microswitch and pull it and HOLD it forward (so as to trip the switch), that should reverse the direction of travel of the V-levers and permit you to not have to resort to releasing the brass clips by hand. It may be that the bend in that small metal lever part is not sharply angled enough anymore so as to trip the switch (as it is supposed to) when the top reaches its almost closed position.

Here is a photo of the B-Pillar microswitch (note that it has been removed from its installed position for this photo).

In my case, when I had a similar problem, replacing the clamshell microswitch took care of the issue. You might try removing that (clamshell) switch and cleaning the contacts as a first step.

Take a look at some of the photos and descriptions in recent (last 3 months) threads, and that should give you some guidance in getting your top working again.

As far as getting the "top open" warning light to go out at the appropriate times, I have not been able to get to the bottom of that yet. That is my last remaining hurdle and has been for a few weeks.

Regards, Maurice.

Maurice

Any progress yet ? Believe it or not our 1998 2.5 is now showing same problem and excellent indie in Scotland is having a hard time getting it sorted. We replaced the spool in the steering wheel a few months ago which had started breaking up and since then that dammed light won't go off and gives out the same error code 21 as yours.

He is working on it today after doing all wiring traces yesterday and is going to swap in another airbag from a Boxster in for service to see if it gives different readings and the light goes off.

V.frustating as we have sold the car and said we would get the light fixed before handing it over. If this takes any longer we will be abel to hand it over as a vintage :D

Tony:

Some work, but no definite progress yet. I removed the air bag on the steering wheel again and cleaned all of the contacts between the airbag and steering wheel and any grounds to the chassis in that area, after removing the instrument cluster. Fault code 21 is still there, as are the seat belt buckle codes.

I am going to attempt to attack this in reverse, i.e., by pulling out the seats and installing the "service belt buckle sets" on both sides according the the TSB (#6924, dated 01/04) to try to get rid of those codes first.

If I get really lucky, it might be that my Durametric is mistaken and the "21" code is really not called for. We'll see.

If your mechanic pinpoints something definitive, please let me know. I'll keep you posted as well.

Regards, Maurice.

Thanks Maurice for the useful information :)

Is there a need to replace the transmission bracket when swapping out the motor mount then?

Clubhead:

Sorry, I don't have first hand information on that question. Maybe the dealer just trying to replace the additional parts so it's not an unknown, but that's only a guess on my part.

How much mileage on the current mount and brackets?

Regards, Maurice.

Peter:

We are like two peas in a pod. The warning light staying on is the only part I have not been able to figure out. The top works better than ever (actually when I bought the car it did not work at all), and very smoothly, but I, like you, have to keep an eye on the clamshell.

BTW, you mentioned the factory manual. I read that you have the supplement describing how to test the input into the "relay/controller" socket. I could not figure out those procedures at all (i.e, where to connect each voltmeter lead, did the whole relay panel have to come out first, etc.). I did figure out and was able to test the last few steps that involve the wires from the motor, and I got the values that are indicated... so that is eliminated as a possible source of this remaining problem.

If you look at the Bentley manual, they have reproduced another part of that supplement, which spell out which circuit is supposed to read "open" or "closed" with all of the varying permutations of top up/top down/clamshell up/clamshell down/in between, etc. Maybe with your superior electrical knowledge (mine is not far away from nil), you can figure something out that way.

If it will help you, I replaced my top relay (control module in the kick panel) and it did not solve the problem. I'm still working on it and trying to get a solution from my contacts, but still no luck. If I figure it out, I'll let you know.

If you have any (really simple) instructions on how to do the above two tests, let me know as I would like to try them.

Regards, Maurice.

Hey Marice,

Sounds like your Bentley manual has the same info as mine. Probably just in plain English.

I read that you have the supplement describing how to test the input into the "relay/controller" socket. I could not figure out those procedures at all (i.e, where to connect each voltmeter lead, did the whole relay panel have to come out first, etc.).

This I don’t know, I haven’t tried it yet, I to was sort of befuddled by the manual... wasn’t particularly inspiring. As to taking the whole panel out, were as easy as the rear relay panel, I wouldn’t hesitate, but I doubt it is. You out be able to wiggle your v-meter probes in there. Or buy some alligator clips that fit the ends of your meter and stick a piece of wire or something on them to better angle them in.

My supplement is out there on the net somewhere. I forgot where I found it but would be happy to email it if you want, bout a 3.5 page pdf.

That’s a little gratifying for me in that with the same problem, a new relat didn’t solve the problem. I was afraid I’ have to buy on and not be able to return it…electrical (were you able to return yours?…no questions?

The “relay” has a fair amount of circuitry which is strange to me in that aside from the “ease down” aspect (when the clam shell trips the back micro-switch, the light goes out but the motor continues for a second or so to snug it in the shell in place). The rest could all be accomplished by electro-mechanical means (I.E. regular old relays).

Do anyway there’s a guy in LA who makes it down my way every once and awhile, seems keen on helping me out by swapping relay/controller with his, for a minuet to see if that solves my problem. But, in that you’ve got the same problem with no change with a new relay/controller, that could mean our problems are in the wiring/switch loop. This I might be able to hunt down…weird though

I’ll psyche my self up to attack that relay socket and let you know what I find out

Regards, Peter

Peter:

My friend has a body shop and a customer brought in his Boxster (MY97) for some body repair and mentioned that he had "accidentally" run over his top relay while trying to figure something out. So, when my friend ordered a brand new relay for that car, we tried it out in my car after trying it out in his car. His car: fine... My car: NG, same as before. We went back and forth more than a few times just to make sure, even tried my old relay on his car, and that worked fine as well(but only on his car). Asked my friend if we could just swap cars (same colors, Ocean Blue Metallic) after he finished the paint repair, but he wouldn't go that far. Oh well! LOL.

As for the manual and the supplements, thanks for the offer, but I have hard copies of both. Like I said they didn't do me much good except for verifying the last three steps that involve the wiring to the motor, and that was okay.

I tried sticking in paper clips and even some special Radio Shack connectors into the relay terminals, but I still couldn't make heads or tails as to what kind of reading to get or which voltmeter lead to put where, etc...

The "ease-down" aspect may indeed be the key. One of my friends suggested putting a foam pad or a spring under the clamshell where it will come into contact with the black plastic crooked arm microswitch sooner to see if, when it gets tripped sooner, it might turn the warning light off. Kinda makes sense, but then, how does that affect the turning off of the warning light on the return trip when the clamshell opens to allow the top to come up on its way to closing at the windshield?

Hmmm... I suppose it may be possible that if it goes off on the way down as the clamshell is closing, we may get a different result on the warning light when it starts out as "off" when the clamshell opens again to allow the top to go up towards closing at the windshield... I will try that and see what happens.

Let me know what you think and keep me posted. I'll do the same.

Regards, Maurice.

PK:

Can't help you with this one because I'm in New York, but I was wondering what your current symptoms are?

Regards, Maurice.

Hey Maurice,

My problem is that my "top' works but doesn’t stop by itself in either full up and full down positions + the convertible light on the dash never goes out. Have to watch the clamshell shut and let off the button.

As you know, having patiently held my hand through the whole ordeal, a couple weeks ago I went through the whole top mechanism & fixed all kinds of things, tested others. Now that I can finally work it nicely with the switch (with an eye on the clamshell), I’d like it to be “all it can be”.

I am pretty sure I checked the micro-switches with a DMM for continuity and they seemed to be in order. I’ve got a manual supplement describing how to test the input into the “relay/controller” socket. But as usual with these official Porsche manuals are pretty arcane. Haven’t siked myself up to measure every thing.

Regards,

Peter

Peter:

We are like two peas in a pod. The warning light staying on is the only part I have not been able to figure out. The top works better than ever (actually when I bought the car it did not work at all), and very smoothly, but I, like you, have to keep an eye on the clamshell.

BTW, you mentioned the factory manual. I read that you have the supplement describing how to test the input into the "relay/controller" socket. I could not figure out those procedures at all (i.e, where to connect each voltmeter lead, did the whole relay panel have to come out first, etc.). I did figure out and was able to test the last few steps that involve the wires from the motor, and I got the values that are indicated... so that is eliminated as a possible source of this remaining problem.

If you look at the Bentley manual, they have reproduced another part of that supplement, which spell out which circuit is supposed to read "open" or "closed" with all of the varying permutations of top up/top down/clamshell up/clamshell down/in between, etc. Maybe with your superior electrical knowledge (mine is not far away from nil), you can figure something out that way.

If it will help you, I replaced my top relay (control module in the kick panel) and it did not solve the problem. I'm still working on it and trying to get a solution from my contacts, but still no luck. If I figure it out, I'll let you know.

If you have any (really simple) instructions on how to do the above two tests, let me know as I would like to try them.

Regards, Maurice.

Maurice,

Got great answers but some info:

When I bought my 2.5L used I had similar issues and although I know I had the seatbelt fault I believe I saw the air bag (SRS) fault you mentioned. I'm trying to check my screenshots of the durametric to "back this up".

I bought the kit buckles and ground set too. I noted when I got everything apart that the ground wires appeared to have been done by the PO so I sent the kit back and installed the buckles. That problem never reared it's ugly head.

About the same time I replaced the horn issue with the bad bushings in the air bag frame. After that was fixed (which included disengaging the air bag lead) and putting it back on the "other error" never appeared again.

I don't have you answer but getting the air bag out is a 10 minute job. It may be worth checking the wires in that area for cuts/chafes. I don't recall how the circular spring wiring is in the Boxster but in my Saabs their failure has always triggers SRS lights. I've relplaced the twice in my Saab with 260K miles.

Shawn

Ohio

Shawn:

Thanks for the info. Will definitely check the wires for cuts/chafes as this most recent variety of airbag light only reared its ugly head about 3 months ago.

Regards, Maurice.

Anybody know how many ground wires exist between the air bag in the steering wheel and the car chassis and between the steering wheel and the car chassis? Locations?

Regards, Maurice.

Hey....... yes I did it myself. You can purchase the material at any automotive upholstery supply store. It is a good weekend project but you will need some hands with it. Here are some tips I recommend. Before you start to detach your old thread, make sure you mark your center point on the top & bottom. Then you want to make a exactly matching template by transferring your old window ,make sure you mark your existing factory stitch marking too.That way your new window will fit tight.

Hey.....cracked the back window in my 2000 'S' today and was thinking about getting a glass window replacement top.

You are saying you replaced your plastic window for less than $30?? That's crazy! Did you sew the window in yourself? Where did you buy the plastic replacement window and how did you fit it?

Any help would be greatly appreciated!

Ashley

Calgary, Canada

Juniinc:

Great job, with good photos!

If you could compile a avery detailed DIY with additional photos and list of materials, it could be revolutionary.

Regards, Maurice.

Thanks! Maurice. It is all 1 piece.

Crystal Clear! Thanks again. :clapping:

Regards, Maurice.

I search the whole list and did not see this request...........

...Has anyone added the liner to their pre 2000 boxsters?

Thanks.

SGG

SGG:

There's a guy over on PPBB that posted that he was going to add a liner to his early Boxster and do a photo and text DIY for the procedure in about two weeks.

I'll keep an eye on that and post here if he comes through.

Regards, Maurice.