atmorris

Curious. I haven't heard or seen any reports of a SS setup causing problems like this. What SS setup does the car have in it? Is it a true B&M, Porsche, or a knock off ?

A couple of comments on this....... The rear speaker kit is designed primarily to change the soundfield center inside the car and add a sense of presence. The 3 1/2" drivers included in the kit are not bright by nature, as they carry a wide frequency response for a small driver. The drivers in the PNP kit are much higher quality and have better power handling than the stock drivers. That being said, if a brighter output is what you desire, the PNP kit is designed to allow you to change the drivers easily. So you could change to a brighter driver like MB Quart or something similar, fairly inexpensively. However, be aware that the crossovers in these Becker systems are hardwired inside the amp, so the frequencies being fed to the rear channels may be being limited, not unlike the door speakers are....not sure on this. With a 4 channel amp system, you are driving the rears off of the HU, so there is not a lot of power driving them either. However, I think you may have a connection issue here. The installer may have tapped into the door speaker leads in error. I have the PNP kit installed in my '03 with an M490 option, meaning that the rears are handled by a 5th and 6th channel. If the fader is turned full rear, I do find the speakers to be subdued on high frequencies and a bit flat. However, They are not excessively muddy or bassy. In fact, I think this is necessary, since the fronts are so bright firing up into the glass, that the subdued highs and stronger mids from the rear speakers balances the soundstage. Frankly, I would find exceptionally bright speakers in the rear channels to be annoying right behind my head, and the soundfield (with fader at a balance point F vs R) would be overly bright inside the car (in total.) Andy

This sounds like a bad lead, connector, or connection somewhere in that channel's wiring. I would check and clean all of the ends, connectors, joints on that channel and the back of the head unit. I would also check and clean all the groundings and the door connector. If that doesn't solve the problem go looking for a pinch, partial break, or a a rub spot in the wiring. It sounds like an intermittant short or partial disconnect in that channel's wiring. It is also possible that there is a problem with the left channel in the amplifier circutry. You may need to have the head unit/amp looked at.

I doubt it too. The pics of the enclosures he has do look like they plug into the door connector when you install them in the door. The ones that came out of my MY03 were not like that, there was a lead run external to the enclosure. Still, my bet is that the wiring on the other side of the door sill isn't there, and will have to be run by the installer. I believe that the door speaker leads would have run from the door connector up to the 4x40 amplifier, and another cable runs from the amp to the back of the Becker HU. That would have been part of the optional door speaker package I believe. I believe the door speaker option added a 4x40 amp and the door speakers. I don't think the HU alone is powerful enough. However, I am not certain of the older models' specifics. Either way, everyones comments here have a large degree of truth to them. The stock drivers are crap. The stock amps are decent but severly under powered, especially with the top down. The least expensive route to improving the stock system follows this basic progression: 1) Replace the 4"+ 3/4" dash drivers with high quality 4" coaxials or 4+1 component systems. This will not be a direct replace deal, and will require minor modifications. These peocesses are well documented on this board....to the point of step-by-step instructions with illustrations. This alone will significantly improve the sound. 2) Add the rear storage compartment and PNP rear storage compartment speaker kit. PNP also sells this kit with the amp for those who need it. Not sure if it is the Becker amp or not. Priced reasonable, great instructions, good drivers, easy install. This makes a HUGE difference in the soundfield in the car - but does not address the lack of low end bass response. 3a) This step has a couple of different ways to go.....Add good quality 5" drivers in the door enclosures is the cheapest and easiest. Better yet is to modify the stock enclosures to accept 6 1/2" drivers, or mount 6 1/2" drivers in the doors on a custom made baffle as my instructions illustrate. -OR- 3b) Forget the door option and install a powered sub system such as the Kenwood unit that Chris was talking about earlier. This is a slightly more expensive route than upgrading the doors, but will provide better bass response, especially below about 60hz. 4) Finally, replace the HU with better quality units such as the Nakamichi CD-400, 500, or 700 HU ( there are others of course), and install a good quality a 4x80 or 4x100 amp(6x80 or 6x100 if you have added door speakers). The Nak HU's have a look closest to stock and are much higher quality electronics than the Becker units. The extra amp power (over stock 4x40 or 6x40 units) is needed when the top is down, and to drop distortion levels and get better S/N ratio or THD. Its a process. Hey, doing stuff like this is half the fun of owning. There aren't that many improvements you can make to a Porsche by yourself. :)

i just picked up one of these!!! Yep...that's the one I think I want too. Kind of bouncing back and forth between this one and a Pioneer AVIC-N3, because it has the nav system as well. The Nak looks more stock though, and I'm sure the sound is tight.

hi Andy, as you know, i used your fabulous instructions and choice of speakers for my upgrade. i didn't use the door baffle that you created... i tried and i just wasn't getting the sound i wanted. so i Dremeled out my OEM speaker enclosures to fit the 6.5" MBQ speakers. this seemed to work pretty well, but i still don't have the bass-iness that i'm looking for. i'm not a 600W hip-hop shake-the-street guy either. but i think eventually i'm going to get a real sub so i have that low end that i'm looking for. i've seen two styles of boxster doors. one is basically flat from top to bottom, and the other has the 'lip' to accomodate a speaker. without the lip, i don't see how a speaker could be added since the speaker depth would prevent the window from working correctly. maybe i'm wrong... i can't remember exactly. but i think it would be a lot of work to add door speakers for little gain. Different strokes for different folks :thumbup: I added some accoustical material to the inside of the door panel in mine and got decent mid bass response, which was what I was after. Those speakers and that amp combination are never going to produce the lower end of the bass range like a sub will. There isn't enough power and the speakers are not built for it. My problem with the system is more that it is now simply underpowered, but I knew this would be the case going in to that upgrade (and said so in my article). I have a 6x100 amp to replace the 6x40 stock unit, but I am not going to change that out until this winter when I upgrade the HU in the car.

hi Andy, as you know, i used your fabulous instructions and choice of speakers for my upgrade. i didn't use the door baffle that you created... i tried and i just wasn't getting the sound i wanted. so i Dremeled out my OEM speaker enclosures to fit the 6.5" MBQ speakers. this seemed to work pretty well, but i still don't have the bass-iness that i'm looking for. i'm not a 600W hip-hop shake-the-street guy either. but i think eventually i'm going to get a real sub so i have that low end that i'm looking for. i've seen two styles of boxster doors. one is basically flat from top to bottom, and the other has the 'lip' to accomodate a speaker. without the lip, i don't see how a speaker could be added since the speaker depth would prevent the window from working correctly. maybe i'm wrong... i can't remember exactly. but i think it would be a lot of work to add door speakers for little gain. Sorry...I neglected to mention. I also know that Kevin Bennet at RoadsterSound (www.roadstersound.com) is working on a sub system for the Boxster right now. It is still in prototype stage but is probably only a few months from being available commercially. You might want to wait a while more Chris.....

what year car do you have? does your car have an amp? what stereo model do you have? again, IMHO i wouldn't even bother. if you're looking for sound quality, get yourself a rear speaker kit, upgrade your dash speakers and get a real sub. :) Adding the PNP rear speaker kit will make a BIG difference in the sound stage, but Chris is right, it won't address the bass issue. The Kenwood sub is a good solution, the door speaker solution is possible as well. I wanted to stay as "stock" looking as possible so I have 6 1/2" MB Quart subs in my doors. They are a huge improvement over the stock 5" junk that was there, but to be fair, I'm not a 600W hip-hop blast your windows out bass lover either...I just like punchy,tight, and clean bass. I don't believe the door panels in any year Boxster are all that different from one another, so putting speakers in the doors shouldn't be a big deal. Wiring them in a Boxster that didn't have door speakers, on the other hand might be a bit more of a challange. The Boxster has a socketed contact arrangement for the wiring normally running between the door pillars and the door. There are probably some open contact points in the molded seats that you could utilize(especially if the door speakers were an option on your MY), but I'm not sure where you can get the contact parts from. Maybe one of the other guys on the board knows.

I believe that is accurate. In a 4x40 system, I believe the PNP kit drives off the head unit. A word on this approach though....the system you are describing will be ok with the top up, and will sound a bit better, but will be pretty severely under powered for top down volume of any appreciable level.

It is quite obvious that this ia a Whoshadiggit. I am certain of this, since it is located right next to the Whachamacallit. :thumbup: ....sorry, I couldn't help myself......

Glad to see it is helping you guys out. Not a bad way to spend a weekend. I enjoyed doing it. Andy

CDR23 is MOST BUSS system device. FO connection between HU and Amp. Speaker connections are wire - FO connections can't be used between an amp and a speaker..FO carries data, not current. HU is the driver of the MOST buss, if removed, the entire MOST system is useless....so.... If HU is changed, amp will have to be changed out also. Not 100% certain about the Bose drivers, but the M490 system drivers are all 4ohm, I suspect the Bose are as well. If you re-amp, go for a bit more power. The system is underpowered with the top down. 60 watts per channel or more would be better. If you can handle the mod, put 6 1/2" drivers in the doors, it improves bottom end tremendously. The 4 1/2" dash speakers tend to be very bright, a speaker that is a little "warmer" will sound better up there. Check this out, it might help: http://www.renntech.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=9613 Andy

It went fine mee. I put the Harvey Penick rear speaker kit in, updated the dash speakers to MB Quart DKD110's, and put MB Quart DKE116 (6 1/2" coaxial) in the doors. The bass response is clean and strong, the system sounds 100x better than the stock drivers without changing the head or amp. With the top up it sounds super. With the top down, it still sounds very good, but the amp's limitations come into play a lot more. I would say it was well worth the investment in hardware and time. I documented the whole project (complete with pics) and uploaded it to the DIY section. Depth on the door speakers wasn't an issue for me because I removed the stock tuned enclosures and mounted the speakers in mounting baffles I made to fit with the stock door panels. I can tell you I do not see how a 6 1/2" driver could be properly mounted in the stock enclosure, although some say they have done it. Removing the door panels is no big deal as long as you research it before hand and take your time. If you rush, your likely to screw something up. I also documented this process in the articly I wrote. Here is a link to the article: http://www.renntech.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=9613

Ditto here. He even made me a set of sill plates up special because I liked one of the Carrera styles he had, but needed them for a Boxster. He didn't charge me a nickel more than his "stock" Boxster plates, and I had them an a day or two. He doesn't sell junk, and his customer service is outstanding. He's a hell of a nice guy to boot.

then the best option would be one of the aerokit wings then as they are designed by porsche for the car? only if coupled with the new front end too, the aerokit addresses aerodynamics of the whole car, adding only half of it will be potentially dangerous, the aerokit is supposed to work as advertised, it's just expensive Notice that Porsche warns not to use the Aerokit rear wing without changing the front as well. The front and rear aero pieces are designed to work together to rebalance the air flow over and under the car. Most definitely illustrates the point. :thumbup:

...and that's exactly where I was coming from on this. If you don't track the car, or drive at high speed- EVER - than put what ever the heck you want on there...it doesn't make a **** bit of difference. If you track the car though, and don't happen to have a spare 911 hanging around :P , you could find yourself getting an unpleasent suprise thrown at you in a high speed corner somewhere if you have played with the wing. Maybe it's only a DE event, or a club run, but the speeds are track speeds, not 90mph....and if you don't think (as one guy here suggested) that aerodynamics play a BIG part in handling and stability at a "slow" 157 mph......... :censored: P.S guys...the difference between 75 mph and 95 mph, aerodynamically, IS significant, because the effect of the air velocity is squared as Binaryc pointed out in his post. Removing the "daming" effect of the stock rear spoiler will have the effect (at speed) of increasing the rate of airflow over the TOP of the car while the airflow under the car remains the same. This causes a pressure imbalance that creates a LIFT vector...that last thing you want to have at high speeds - unless of course you wish to fly (quite literally.) The faster you go, the stronger the lift force gets. :help: Bottom line...... if you track the car, or plan on doing some DE's, leave the stock spoiler in place. If not, and everyday driving, fun runs, maybe a little AX, is the extent of your Boxster experience - then throw on there whatever floats your boat. It isn't going to change the handling at all.

Notice that the Caymen has a base spoiler, at the same angle as the riser spoiler. The two work together to direct the airflow up off the deck lid at speed. Putting the riser spoiler alone on a Boxster would not acheive the same aerodynamic affect ,since the second spoiler is missing. . . Of course, if looks are the only concern, I guess it doesn't really matter.

I was debating whether or not changing this would upset the aerodynamic balance at speed as well (I do take some short runs "at speed" now and then). Then I realized something - Ruf doesn't touch the rear wing on the Boxster in their mods. If it's good enough for Ruf to leave alone, it's good enough for me to leave alone. End of debate. Stock wing is still there. These are my thoughts. I'm not an aerodynamicist, but I do have a bit of history with drag racing cars and their aerodynamics. The Boxster has a VERY low drag coefficient. It is slippery through the air. A car can't be that slippery without managing the airflow element of the design. It seems to me that the Boxster rear wing is designed either to keep the airflow over the back of the car from causing a turbulent zone to exist too close to the back of the car (at high speeds,) or to keep the airflow over the car from becoming higher velocity than the airflow under the car, as this would cause some degree of lift I would think. Without the spoiler raising up and causing the air flow to move up away from the deck lid a bit, it might be that the airflow over and under the car would become imbalanced and things could get a bit dicey. This, of course, is irrelevant at speeds under maybe 80 to 100mph. I just don't think I'd like to find out if I am right or not at say 130 or 140. Again, the fact that Ruf doesn't change a thing back there speaks volumes to me. The double wing setup does look hot, but since the wings allow airflow both over and under them, I don't see how they could possibly achieve the same affect aerodynamically, although I concede that it might be enough to avoid anything nasty hapening. I have kind of stayed away from any rear wing change because of that. Any aerodynamicists lurking around here ?

Tony, Any pics of the Alpine 9857 HU installed? How "un-stock" (fit wise) does it look mounted ? Still making up my mind what way to go with the HU.

Try this guy's plates, you won't be sorry......Nice as stock SS plates, WAY cheaper. Contact Harvey at this email harveypnp@comcast.net I have a set on my MY03 that Harvey made, and I love them. Super nice guy. Easy to deal with.

Where did you mount the amps? How did you route the power wires ? Did you use sheilded, high quality RCA cables? Is it an inexpensive translater? Sounds like a shielding issue.

When I did mine, I used 3/4" oak for the mount plate, covered with sound deadening material. It would have been a bit better if I had used 5/8" oak but 3/4" is what I had around. I didn't reuse the plastic "tuned" port enclosure. For one thing, it isn't tuned to a 6 1/2" driver anyway. I also didn't put any accoustical materials on the inside of the doors, as I didn't want to provide a water trap. The bass is clean, it does not sound boomy or exagerated. It does vibrate my mirrors a little, but not annoyingly. I am using the stock 6x40 amp right now though. I have a 6x100W amp to install, and that may change things and cause some issues, but I won't use this amp until I change the HU out.

It isn't quite that simple. The crossovers are built into the stock amp. You can't get full range out of the door speakers by just replacing them. You could tap the door speaker leads into the front (or rear) channel outputs, but this will change the impedence load on the front speaker outs from 4 to 8 ohms. That will make the amp even less efficient than it already is, but it is doable. The only other option would be to change out both the amp and the speakers, but then there is the problem of HU to amp connections if your car is a MOST bus system, so you wind up changing out the HU as well. I don't think this is an issue on pre-MOST systems, but I have no experience with them.

Russ, I don't know about these particular tires but..... no offense guys, but I know I'm not strappin my butt in any car capable of over 150mph, thats outfitted with $29.95 J.C.Penny tires (or the equivilent). I agree that price doesn't necessarily = performance, but don't you think that if Porsche thought for one minute that they could get the same performance out of a $60 tire that they could a $200 tire, they would be outfitting the car with the $60 tires and increasing their profit margins....I do. One way or another....you always get what you pay for.