perryinva

Not sure what boss you mean. Did they actually tell you the one they are sending has a boss on it? I also thought it was just a hole, with the bracket mounted through it.

I see it's been almost a year since this topic has been visited, and also saw I never followed up. Identical issue as described above with my '02 C2 with 47k miles on it, and has had the problem since I bought it 4 years ago with 30k miles, plus also had very loud and annoying "creaking wooden ship" syndrome, whenever the steering wheel, with any bump at all, was turned after the car warmed up. I replaced the struts with PSS9s, and ARBs with M030 ones, and the bushings were lubed with Krytox. All new rubber mounts and bearings on the upper strut mounts (used X74 for front), with Bilstein slip sheets at the spring perches. That eliminated all the groaning and creaking, but not what sounded like some kind of loose suspension part whenever the car was warmed up, including driving on the interstate for just 10 miles, and pulling into any parking lot, where the smallest bumps made what sounded like small deep rattle, barely felt in the steering wheel. Careful listening, and I could interpret the sound as a binding noise from something that "popped" in to position in small increments. I finally went and bought the Gudcraft Inner Tie Rod tool kit, $55 shipped from Amazon, that includes the 1 1/4" crow foot (equal to the required 32mm), and the $15 outer ball joint tool from Napa. TRW Inner and Outer tie rods were available, shipped, on line for ~$200 for the set of 4. They are a perfect match, hopefully improved some, over the Porsche ones, slightly beefier. With those tools, I was able to replace all 4 rod ends in about 90mins, the hardest part being removing the crimped SS band on the accordian boot, without damaging the boot. A #36 hose clamp replaces them perfectly. I counted the threads showing on each side and installed the new inners with red Loctite and the same number of threads showing, & the difference was easily felt just manually moving the parts around. Since I had recently lowered the suspension, & settled it in with the old tires and then installed new PS2s, I was going to get it aligned anyway, so I knew I had to replace the tie rods before that. When I took the car for a drive, the difference in the steering feel was palpable, and very much lighter/smoother, and after 30 minutes of driving where I was positive it would have made that same annoying sound, I am happy to report it is gone, gone, gone! The tie rods I removed, both inner and outer on both sides look perfect, boots are in excellent shape, & have they have zero play, but they just bind once warmed up. I figure I saved at least $1200 in labor costs doing the struts, ARBs, and tie rods myself, so I didn't feel as bad shelling out $1400 for the N3 PS2s (225/40 & 285/30-18s). Add me to the list of "Replace tie rod ends" to kill suspension noise.

Advance has the 5qt jugs of Castrol Edge 5w-40 on sale pretty often for $32 + a free oil filter, (of course you have to get 2 ). They will normally credit me the filter price towards the purchase of a Mobil 1 spin on to use with the LN spin on adapter I have on my 996, as long as the other filter is the advertized one to use on one of my other cars, so with 2 filters, its even cheaper!

We sure don't need another oil thread, and Loren is, I'm sure even more tired of them, so the LAST thing I want to do is fan any flames, but I just DON'T GET where the "higher viscosity oil is better at higher ambient temps" mantra comes from! Oil viscosity and lubrosity/protection have nothing to do with each other! Oil is simultaneously a coolant, a lubricant, and hydraulic fluid. The manufacturer doesn't list viscosities based on selling oil or engines or what ever, as most any oil supplier can meet whatever viscosity is required. They list the values for what best serves the functions the oil has to perform, with the additive packages and shear stabilizers, etc that the oil tested at the time has in its formula, for the majority of users that drive the car, as it would be expected to drive on the street. That is why Porsche constantly updates the recommended oil lists, to compensate for what the oil producers are doing to their oil, and to provide choices of oil, some that may be more suitable for more high speed use vs pedestrian use.. It is unfortunate that Porsche uses the motor oil ina performance engine in so many ways, because it makes it hard to say "As long as this spec is met, it is fine", because the specs may be for things that do not cover what the oil needs to do in this particular engine, for the function it is being used for. No one can expect Porsche to put in writing "If you track your car, change to THIS oil, then on the interstate, use THAT oil", it would be insane, so of course they try to cover as many bets as possible, and just list oils and ambient recommended ranges. Seriously, obviously, it's your car, put what ever you want in it, of course, but please understand that when your start your car in the morning, whether its 40°F or 140°F outside, as far as the engine is concerned, it is cold.The pumps are pushing oil through tiny holes, and minute clearances, and if you run 15w-50, or 20-60, baby, it ain't moving like the engine needs it to, I guarantee..During that time things be wearing. That "thick" oil is doing nothing, because it just isn't there. That local tight tolerance location is heating up and friction rises, and wear with it, because the oil just isn't flowing, which 0w or 5W cold oil will. At operating temperature, 0w-40 or 5w-40, is 40 weight, so it's doing what it needs at that temperature, for normal operating conditions. It's not "too thin" or "water', it's what's needed, as designed. Why does anyone think that 50 or 60 is better, becuase it is harder to flow? The thicker oil does not form a superior barrier to wear, or "take up slop" like it did on old worn Chevy engines from the 60's or 70s. Now, just like you wouldn't track a car on passenger touring tires, an engine that is purposely track built, will likely need a higher viscosity at the higher temps and constant higher rpms it will run at, because they WILL be operating at higher RPMs and temps, which if you drive your car on the street, even in 115°F ambient temps, even spiritedly, you will not see. Anyone that thinks that production Porsches are hard core track ready is nuts, and I don't even track hardly at all. You can't have your cake and eat it too with oil, unfortunately, just like you can't have a single perfect tire for snow, rain, cruising and the track. It's just that tires are easy to change, and oil is not, relatively speaking. So unless you have your oil tested every time you change it, and KNOW what the results mean, and tear the engine down regularly to check for tolerances and wear, you are either going on the faith that Porsche knows what it is talking about, or your mechanic, or some guy on the internet (no one specifically referenced, just a random example) that "used this oil for 20k miles, and no problems so far". Seriously? Did you expect the engine to be so poorly built that if you used the wrong oil it would explode or something? You CAN'T know whats happening inside, by just feel or driving it. The temp gauge means little, as it is only one reference point. By the time you know whether or not you made a bad choice, it's likely, too late. Is Porsche perfect? Oh HELL NO, let's not go there, but they HAVE been building and lubricating their engines a pretty long time, so since I know I can't come up with a legitimately better educated decision on what to use, I'll go with their recommendation. Just my long winded $0.02. Sorry.

The 997.2 doesn't have an IMS?

Your noise is likely tie rod ends. You would have noticed any issue with the links with the ROW M030 install when you put on the new ARBs. Usually the inner tie rods, but can be outers, as well. You can feel no play in the TREs when on the car, or on a lift, too much tension to be moved by hand. Once removed, the play in the joint is evident. Very annoying.

Thanks, you guys are great!

I was pulling my mufflers, to get the PSE hack done, (since the car is up on the lift for a while, waiting for my oil pan to come in) and decided it might be easier to undo those 3 bolts that hold it in place to the bracket, if I removed the coil packs shield from the engine. It is held on by 2 10mm bolts. When I removed the shield from the drivers side of the engine, a tube of what appears to be heat reflective fabric, with a strip of velcro on it, fell out! It forms a tube about 1 1/4 inch in diameter about 8 inches long. Anyone with any idea where it is supposed to go??!! Thanks!

Did you ever get an answer.? I'm sure you have figured it out, as you can't have been without the car this long! I'd like to know, as well!.Thanks.

Which is the correct tie rod tool from HF? I need to do the same thing!

SO Dan, what happened??!! Did you finally get it in??

I use 93 in Virginia all the time. Try to always stick to a Top Tier station as the '02s and newer have no fuel filter. Get 22 mpg avg with a normal foot on my '02 C2 6speed.

Seriously? The one facing the windshield. Cover it and it fools the mirror into thinking it's dark out. The one in the mirror glass has to be uncovered to sense the headlights behind you in order to darken.

I know this is beating a dead horse, but I'd be remiss if I didn't say something and someone got hurt. I work in a business where industrial accidents will usually kill you and we are trained constantly to watch for things like this. Orient, I love your car, I love your advice, I respect your prowess regarding these cars, but your advice to jack from the engine is just plain dangerous. You have, in essence, said "It's not aproblem at all, as long as you absolutely know that your motor mount will not give way." The sudden shift from a failing motor mount, regardless of the cause or reason, when the car is in the air, absolutely provides a chance for someone to get killed. I don't understand how you can't see this. I KNOW it's only until you get the car properly supported, etc, but the fact is, someone will eventually forget that part, and be under the car when it happens, or it will shift to the side and crush a bystanders foot, not even mentioning the exact thisng that happened to the OPs car from the shifting. It happens so fast, there is no time to react. I specifically asked both the dealer and my indy, last year about this, during a tech session, and he said, point blank, "you'd have to be crazy to do that." When I told him that on the message boards they say all dealers do it regularly, he said, "not ever as long as he's been working on Porsches". I am sorry, but you are wrong to recommend this. If you want to insist it's alright, then please preface it with something like "This advice can get you killed, but this is what I do" My $0.02.

Truly an EXCELLENT write up and fantastic pictures. What a great job! He is to be commended. More than a "little" IMS bearing leakage into the IMS. How many km on your car?

New 944 in '82 at 24. Just got divorced, like I needed a reason. Sold it in '87 to buy a house. Used '02 911 C2 in 2008. Paid less for it taking inflation into account. About 10x the car.

Coolant doesn't look normal to me. It is normally a bright pink color for that year. Clean out the "mayonaise" (which also seems a bit much to me for condensation, but I don't know how long/where/how it was stored) and do an oil change. If you see no water/coolant at the bottom when you dump the oil from the catch container to a jug, then just change the coolant , too. It is easy to see the water/coolant when you pour the oil out. There is an updated chain tensioner for certain years, not sure about yours.

BUy the Lloyd ones from Suncoast. Best price and great quality with a choice of embroidery.

Good choice, make sure you post some pics. Sure better than the price they were asking. Its a LOT of high performance car for that money. The best deal out there, I think. I love mine. There are a bunch of little "gotchas" that you will want/need/should do soon after you get it. The kind of stuff even the CPO dealership will rarely, if ever address. There is excellent advice on this site (and Rennlist) on how to do most of them. Off the top of my head: 1. Radiator/AC condenser clean out. Every single person that's bought a used 996/997 has found a ton of leaves/trash/sand, butts, etc up against both rads and between the rads and condensers. On my car, which only had like 30k when I got it, the bottom 6 rows of cooling fins were completely blocked. You have to pull off the front bumper cover to clean them out, as a ton of leaves get wedged between the rads and condenser and block airflow completey and cause corrosion/perforation and possible overheating. The small drain at the rear of the duct gets clogged with sand, so it can stay wet in there. I vaccum out those areas every time (before) I wash my car. Always something in there. 2. Check those plastic underpans. The front 2/3s of the car has underbody airflow improvers/shields. They get hit and break. You don't want them flopping around and catching a stray branch. 3. Check the brake ducts. They often get sheared off. I upgraded mine for the same cost (like $20) to the larger, I think GT ones. There are threads. Keeps your brakes cooler. 4. Check your AOS (air oil separater). Just pull the rubber boot off the throttle intake, and make sure there is no oil right after the throttle plate. You'd much rather replace it on your own terms with CPO if required. A 2003 may already have the updated one. 5. Take the wheels off and do a VERY close visual inspection for flat spots and cracks on the inner lip edges. Those 18"s, especially the rears, are pretty easily cracked or flat spotted if impacted when air pressure is low. They always crack on the inside lip, where it is weaker, and it can't be seen when they are on the car. I'm sure there are others. Surf and ask. This place can be a goldmine of information.

Well, was I right, or was I right? FWIW, I tried to clean my old one, and it was a waste of time on mine. I should have mentioned the collar, too, sorry.

Don't know if this ever got posted here: This is a brief recount of a thread on a different MB. A poster, yellowbmr, stated: "Clunking from front at slow speed anyone? Do you have PSS9? Well read on... -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I started to notice the infamous clunk (those who have PSS9) from the front of the car last year. It was only noticeable at slow speeds <2-3 mph. I took the car to dealer to inspect the end links and they said those are tight as hell. The car was under warranty, so it would have been considered a warranty item, but they didn't see anything wrong with them. The noise radiated through the steering and it felt like something is broken in the front. So I lived with the noise but up to a month ago I coulndn't take it. I researched forums and came up to a thread that mentioend the same symptoms as me. To make the story short, found out on the new PSS9 kits, they come with new washers that eliminate the clunking. These washers were not available on the PSS9's that were bought few years back, but Bielstin has a kit that eliminates the noise for those. The kit is free from Bielstin but the labor is not covered. Lucent had a kit in stock and installed it for me. The noise is gone. While they had the coilovers out, they also cleaned the dust/grease/sand from the top of the coilover, washed the brackets with circuit cleaner, re-applied grease and installed the new kit for me. I paid around 2-3 hours of labor, but it was well worth it." He has not come back with any info, yet, so I made a call to a guy at Bilstein that has been very helpful to me in the past. Here is what I found out and posted: OK, I got the answer. Well, maybe not THE answer, but AN answer. Bilstein in NC and CA have no idea about any free kit to fix the clunk. If the OP has any info, that would be great. HOWEVER, the equivalent solution is pretty cheap. If you looked at your original PSS9/10, the bottom, helper spring, rides on top of a large blue plastic washer, between the spring and the adjustable spring perch. You can order another one for the top of the front helper spring, (2 total needed) 60mm, part number E4-XK6-Z002A00 for $1.50 each. You can also order 70mm ones for the top main springs, front & rear, and the rear helper springs, part number E4-XK6-Z002A01, 10 required, same price. However, the lip on the top spring cup, under the RSM, is pretty shallow, and reducing it by 1.5mm might not be too good an idea. Also, how much clunking comes from the rear, anyway? If you install them, order 2 new main top nuts, as the nylon lock ones are one use only. All the parts form Bilstein, 12 washers and 2 nuts, was $25 shipped. Naturally. as the washers are 1.5mm thick, if you add 3 new ones, then the car is raised 4.5mm higher than the designed range, and that must be accounted for in keeping it within Bilsteins lowering limits. Bilstein east coast is 1-800-745-4636, ask for Parts or Kieth Robertson. They ship out of CA, so you might also want to call CA direct. Hope others with PSS9/10s find this helpful.

None anywhere near as likely as the switch. This is so common as to be funny. (not) When you replace it, be sure to get out that one screw that's on a diagonal from the side. It's pretty hard to see, unless you know it's there. It's a cheap (for Porsche) and easy (for Porsche) fix. ANd buy it online at Sunset or Suncoast. The difference from the dealer was like $40 here.

No doubt at all in my mind, I'd go with the CPO car, (assuming cosmetics/paint/etc are close to equal) but still work on that price. More like $27-28, highest. A car with too few mile after 7 years can almost be more of an issue as the 996 gotchas (RMS, IMS, coolant tank split, etc) may not have manifested themselves yet. On the 61k car, if they were going to happen, they are more like to already have. Or if they did, they've been replaced. PSM, heated seats, Xenons, autodim are worth thousands, especially at resale time. Porsche CPO is excellent. Aftermarket warranties are very touch and go. Go with the CPO, for sure.

I got the exact same shifter from Sunset for $329 about 6 months ago, IIRC.

Yes, it is not that unusual for springs to sag at different times, and it is usually gradual and the drivers side first. However, 56k miles would be a pretty short life. Fender height, while a convenient and valid way to measure, and an easy 'check' (I use it all the time) is not the official Porsche way..they use the bottom of a nut on the control arm in the front, and the bottom of a bore on the rear suspension. I'd guess that there is a reason they say to do it that way, maybe for worn bushings, bent arms, etc. The numbers have been posted many times on this site. That said, however, anyone that states that a strut does not affect the height of a car, has never replaced them. Not trying to flame at all, but while that is true for shocks, and the springs certainly do support the weight of the car, most struts have a significant spring/gas pressure component that most certainly will affect height by easily 1/4 to 1/2". The bounce and settle test is worthless on these cars, as the spring rates prevent hand actuated bouncing. In all likelyhood, the strut is compomised/worn, so you've lost that extra push, and it has settled. You would never notice it on a highway commute, but a couple of switchback turns back to back, on a bumpy road, should reveal the strut issue. I agree with Loren, if you're going to replace a pair with stock, it's not that much more to go the M030 route (which includes sways, too) and see a siginicant improvement in handling and ride height.