996 dumping coolant!

[kcsporsche]

post

Edited October 27, 2011 by kcsporsche

[judgejon]

I dont think this would be a water pump issue. Likely its the cap, hopefully not the tank. stay in touch....

[kcsporsche]

UPDATE: So I figured since the coolant level was ok I was going to try and run the car for a bit and check out the engine temp so see if there were any issue. I drove around for about 15 minutes closely eyeing the temp gauge. I didn't pound on it any just nice casual driving below 5000 rmp. The temp stayed around 182 the whole time. Didn't see any issues at that time. I stopped in a parking lot to check for leaks and it seems like once you let the car idle then it starts to leak. This time it didn't dump all the coolant just a steady drip. If I rev up the engine, even slightly, the leak will stop. So I headed home and every time I stopped at a stop light I would see a little steam coming from the deck lid in my rearview. I would give it a little gas and the steam would go away. Oh yeah the check engine light came on this time.

I tried to use a flashlight to look for the leak source but couldn't pin point it. From the engine compartment the tank looked fine. Nothing leaking around the cap. Couldn't see anything uptop leaking. I couldn't get a good look from underneath

Any ideas? Should I not try driving it again? Don't want to do further damage.

Should I start with replacing the cap then go from there?

Thanks!

[1schoir]

UPDATE: So I figured since the coolant level was ok I was going to try and run the car for a bit and check out the engine temp so see if there were any issue. I drove around for about 15 minutes closely eyeing the temp gauge. I didn't pound on it any just nice casual driving below 5000 rmp. The temp stayed around 182 the whole time. Didn't see any issues at that time. I stopped in a parking lot to check for leaks and it seems like once you let the car idle then it starts to leak. This time it didn't dump all the coolant just a steady drip. If I rev up the engine, even slightly, the leak will stop. So I headed home and every time I stopped at a stop light I would see a little steam coming from the deck lid in my rearview. I would give it a little gas and the steam would go away. Oh yeah the check engine light came on this time.

I tried to use a flashlight to look for the leak source but couldn't pin point it. From the engine compartment the tank looked fine. Nothing leaking around the cap. Couldn't see anything uptop leaking. I couldn't get a good look from underneath

Any ideas? Should I not try driving it again? Don't want to do further damage.

Should I start with replacing the cap then go from there?

Thanks!

kcs:

Since your coolant cap ends in "01", definitely start by replacing the coolant cap.

Since you have gotten a CEL, go to any auto chain store and have the code(s) read and post them here. If the CEL starts flashing, don't drive it as at a minimum, you may damage your catalytic converters.

The "steam" that you see may just be coolant leaking onto the exhaust, but you have to pinpoint the cause of the leak. Eliminate the coolant cap from the equation and go from there.

Regards, Maurice.

[judgejon]

UPDATE: So I figured since the coolant level was ok I was going to try and run the car for a bit and check out the engine temp so see if there were any issue. I drove around for about 15 minutes closely eyeing the temp gauge. I didn't pound on it any just nice casual driving below 5000 rmp. The temp stayed around 182 the whole time. Didn't see any issues at that time. I stopped in a parking lot to check for leaks and it seems like once you let the car idle then it starts to leak. This time it didn't dump all the coolant just a steady drip. If I rev up the engine, even slightly, the leak will stop. So I headed home and every time I stopped at a stop light I would see a little steam coming from the deck lid in my rearview. I would give it a little gas and the steam would go away. Oh yeah the check engine light came on this time.

I tried to use a flashlight to look for the leak source but couldn't pin point it. From the engine compartment the tank looked fine. Nothing leaking around the cap. Couldn't see anything uptop leaking. I couldn't get a good look from underneath

Any ideas? Should I not try driving it again? Don't want to do further damage.

Should I start with replacing the cap then go from there?

Thanks!

kcs:

Since your coolant cap ends in "01", definitely start by replacing the coolant cap.

Since you have gotten a CEL, go to any auto chain store and have the code(s) read and post them here. If the CEL starts flashing, don't drive it as at a minimum, you may damage your catalytic converters.

The "steam" that you see may just be coolant leaking onto the exhaust, but you have to pinpoint the cause of the leak. Eliminate the coolant cap from the equation and go from there.

Regards, Maurice.

Maurice, I thought the .01 was the latest cap until I read your post. the .01 is blue. I've just ordered a .04 from Sunset, on general principles, but wonder what the problem is with the .01? I thought the .01 fixed the seal/pressure problem.. Cheers, jl

[1schoir]

Maurice, I thought the .01 was the latest cap until I read your post. the .01 is blue. I've just ordered a .04 from Sunset, on general principles, but wonder what the problem is with the .01? I thought the .01 fixed the seal/pressure problem.. Cheers, jl

jl:

The .01 version is definitely dated. It has since been superseded by the .02, then .03, and, about a year ago by the .04 version. The different versions of the caps look alike at first glance, but closer inspection of the underside will reveal differences. All of the versions were aimed at preventing coolant loss while keeping the proper pressure, but some have succeeded better than others.

If you have a weak pressure valve inside your coolant cap, it will sometimes let go after you turn off the engine, when the coolant temperature rises for a little while after shutoff.

Regards, Maurice.

Edited November 30, 2010 by 1schoir

[kcsporsche]

UPDATE: So I figured since the coolant level was ok I was going to try and run the car for a bit and check out the engine temp so see if there were any issue. I drove around for about 15 minutes closely eyeing the temp gauge. I didn't pound on it any just nice casual driving below 5000 rmp. The temp stayed around 182 the whole time. Didn't see any issues at that time. I stopped in a parking lot to check for leaks and it seems like once you let the car idle then it starts to leak. This time it didn't dump all the coolant just a steady drip. If I rev up the engine, even slightly, the leak will stop. So I headed home and every time I stopped at a stop light I would see a little steam coming from the deck lid in my rearview. I would give it a little gas and the steam would go away. Oh yeah the check engine light came on this time.

I tried to use a flashlight to look for the leak source but couldn't pin point it. From the engine compartment the tank looked fine. Nothing leaking around the cap. Couldn't see anything uptop leaking. I couldn't get a good look from underneath

Any ideas? Should I not try driving it again? Don't want to do further damage.

Should I start with replacing the cap then go from there?

Thanks!

kcs:

Since your coolant cap ends in "01", definitely start by replacing the coolant cap.

Since you have gotten a CEL, go to any auto chain store and have the code(s) read and post them here. If the CEL starts flashing, don't drive it as at a minimum, you may damage your catalytic converters.

The "steam" that you see may just be coolant leaking onto the exhaust, but you have to pinpoint the cause of the leak. Eliminate the coolant cap from the equation and go from there.

Regards, Maurice.

Thanks for the advise Maurice. The CEL was not flashing so I went to down to Autozone to get the CEL checked out. It came back with code P0491 and P0492. Something about insufficient air flow, possible air solenoid valve or faulty relay. I'll have to research that on the forum.

Do you think that has anything to do with the coolant leakage?

I got the new .04 coolant cap and put it on today. I drove it around for about 10 miles at low RPMs and the temp stayed around the 182 range the whole time. When I parked the car there was still a slight coolant leakage from below. I attached a pic. No steam this time so it seems to have improved a little bit. Not sure if the new cap had anything to do with it or not.

In the picture you can see the coolant. Not sure if it's coming from there or dripping on to there. I also checked the coolant and there doesn't appear to be any oil in there. I opened the cap to the oil and it looked a little suspect. It almost looked like curdled milky residue if you can see in there. When I checked the dip stick the oil looked ok.

[rb101]

If you are still dripping coolant, then you still have a problem, and it's probably a cracked tank or water pump. As for the stuff inside the oil filler cap, it's condensation from water being cooked out of the oil. The coolest part of the engine is the oil filler tube and any moisture collects and condenses there. This is normal and the amount can be reduced by running the car longer to get the engine up to temp. Short trips allow water to build up in the oil.

[911audiophile]

My 2002 C2 has had similar coolant leaks -- in my case, the connectors between the coolant lines under the vehicle (which are metal) and the rubber lines coming off the engine leaked only when I got off the gas. My Indy replaced for less than $100. The connectors are on the passenger side, above rear wheel well.

Had the P0491/0492 codes too. Chased it for months. Turned out to be cracked vacuum cannister. Of course, replaced the electric valves during all this chasing...

Good luck and enjoy the new ride. It will get fixed.

[1schoir]

If you are still dripping coolant, then you still have a problem, and it's probably a cracked tank or water pump. As for the stuff inside the oil filler cap, it's condensation from water being cooked out of the oil. The coolest part of the engine is the oil filler tube and any moisture collects and condenses there. This is normal and the amount can be reduced by running the car longer to get the engine up to temp. Short trips allow water to build up in the oil.

+1 on the condensation.

No worries about intermix, now you just have to find the source of the leak. Those codes are not related to the coolant leak.

Your photo on the right that shows coolant drops near the engine coolant drain cap is most probably the result of coolant dripping from higher up. Check to see if your coolant tank is above that location and also feel around the underside of the tank for wetness.

In that same photo, to the right of the hose clamp you can see traces of dampness near the end of the hose. That doesn't look like the current leak but that area to the right of the circumference of the end of the hose should be COMPLETELY dry and clean. I don't think it's the source of your current leak, but it wouldn't hurt to clean that area and replace the clamp or move it one or two millimeters to the right to see if you get a better seal there.

Regards, Maurice.

Edited November 30, 2010 by 1schoir

[kcsporsche]

Thanks Guys for all the advise. As much as I would like to try and diagnose the problem myself I think I'm getting to the point where I'm just going to take it into a pro for a diagnostic. If it's a simple fix I'll try it myself. Anybody know a good Indy in the Plano or Dallas Texas area?

[judgejon]

Thanks Guys for all the advise. As much as I would like to try and diagnose the problem myself I think I'm getting to the point where I'm just going to take it into a pro for a diagnostic. If it's a simple fix I'll try it myself. Anybody know a good Indy in the Plano or Dallas Texas area?

here are two possibly too simple questions that occurred to me: when the problems started was the coolant tank too full? and, has the coolant been cut with water? whats the coolant/water ratio? If there's water in there, could the water be overheating and causing the leak? Just a thought.... stay with it.... good luck.

Edited November 30, 2010 by judgejon

[kcsporsche]

[

Thanks Guys for all the advise. As much as I would like to try and diagnose the problem myself I think I'm getting to the point where I'm just going to take it into a pro for a diagnostic. If it's a simple fix I'll try it myself. Anybody know a good Indy in the Plano or Dallas Texas area?

here are two possibly too simple questions that occurred to me: when the problems started was the coolant tank too full? and, has the coolant been cut with water? whats the coolant/water ratio? If there's water in there, could the water be overheating and causing the leak? Just a thought.... stay with it.... good luck.

Hummmm.... the coolant tank could have been over filled. If you look at the first set of pictures you can see the large puddle of coolant on the ground yet my tank was still pretty full. There was also a huge cloud of steam coming from the engine on the way home so no telling how much spilled out at that stop light. It's kind of hard to tell the exact coolant level looking through the plastic, but it is near Max. If the majority of the overfilled coolant did expell itself that could be why I'm only seeing a small drip at this time. I'm tempted to take her out again with a little more "spirited" driving to test your theory out.

Where does the coolant over flow normally go?

I just purchased the car so I'm not sure what kind of coolant or at what ratio it was cut. The engine temp hasn't gone over 182ish since I started monitoring it, but I haven't been pushing it either.

Thanks judgejon appreciate the reply. Though I want to join the +1 Cracked Tank Club on the forum I also don't want to. ;)

[1schoir]

Hummmm.... the coolant tank could have been over filled. If you look at the first set of pictures you can see the large puddle of coolant on the ground yet my tank was still pretty full. There was also a huge cloud of steam coming from the engine on the way home so no telling how much spilled out at that stop light. It's kind of hard to tell the exact coolant level looking through the plastic, but it is near Max. If the majority of the overfilled coolant did expell itself that could be why I'm only seeing a small drip at this time. I'm tempted to take her out again with a little more "spirited" driving to test your theory out.

Where does the coolant over flow normally go?

I just purchased the car so I'm not sure what kind of coolant or at what ratio it was cut. The engine temp hasn't gone over 182ish since I started monitoring it, but I haven't been pushing it either.

Thanks judgejon appreciate the reply. Though I want to join the +1 Cracked Tank Club on the forum I also don't want to. ;)

kcs:

The overflow normally goes down a small drain hole, located near one corner, to the side of the pressure relief valve assembly. If you remove the thin black plastic cover, you will see the small drain hole:

From there, there is normally a rubber hose connected to the underside of that drain hole and the hose leads towards the ground. If the hose was disturbed, it may be pointing directly over a part of your exhaust, and that would explain the steam if the tank overflowed.

If the overflow is severe in volume, the coolant will overwhelm the small drain hole and the overflowing coolant will fill up the surrounding area until it goes over the edges of the black part of the coolant tank housing.

Regards, Maurice.

[kcsporsche]

Thanks again Maurice Yeah I need to revise all that previous speculation. When I got home I checked the pressure release valve and it was not popped up. I'm assuming that means there was not excessive pressure. I also didn't see any residue indicating an excessive overflow that would account for the dump of coolant. I was also wrong about the coolant level. I checked again and it was close to min. So looks like a pressure test is in my near future. Probably will end up being the coolant tank. Will update.

Any coolant suggestions? I've read some back and forth about using only Porsche or VW coolant over regular Prestone.

What I did find, in the picture below, is what was probably causing the P0491 and P0492 CEL. I'm no gear head but I'm pretty sure that hose should be connected to the secondary air blower. Hose clamp must had fallen off.

Is there a way to clear the CEL without disconnecting the battery? Otherwise I'll be posting on the Radio Code Help sticky pretty soon...lol.

[1schoir]

Thanks again Maurice Yeah I need to revise all that previous speculation. When I got home I checked the pressure release valve and it was not popped up. I'm assuming that means there was not excessive pressure. I also didn't see any residue indicating an excessive overflow that would account for the dump of coolant. I was also wrong about the coolant level. I checked again and it was close to min. So looks like a pressure test is in my near future. Probably will end up being the coolant tank. Will update.

Any coolant suggestions? I've read some back and forth about using only Porsche or VW coolant over regular Prestone.

What I did find, in the picture below, is what was probably causing the P0491 and P0492 CEL. I'm no gear head but I'm pretty sure that hose should be connected to the secondary air blower. Hose clamp must had fallen off.

Is there a way to clear the CEL without disconnecting the battery? Otherwise I'll be posting on the Radio Code Help sticky pretty soon...lol.

kcs:

Good catch with that disconnected hose!

Go to any auto parts chain store (Autozone, Pep Boys, etc.) and most of them will read and clear the codes for you.

Regards, Maurice.

[judgejon]

Thanks again Maurice Yeah I need to revise all that previous speculation. When I got home I checked the pressure release valve and it was not popped up. I'm assuming that means there was not excessive pressure. I also didn't see any residue indicating an excessive overflow that would account for the dump of coolant. I was also wrong about the coolant level. I checked again and it was close to min. So looks like a pressure test is in my near future. Probably will end up being the coolant tank. Will update.

Any coolant suggestions? I've read some back and forth about using only Porsche or VW coolant over regular Prestone.

What I did find, in the picture below, is what was probably causing the P0491 and P0492 CEL. I'm no gear head but I'm pretty sure that hose should be connected to the secondary air blower. Hose clamp must had fallen off.

Is there a way to clear the CEL without disconnecting the battery? Otherwise I'll be posting on the Radio Code Help sticky pretty soon...lol.

you might consider purchasing a Durametric code reader.... very helpful in many ways, including clearing codes/lights. jl

[kcsporsche]

I considered that but I tend to change out vehicles pretty often and it looks like the Durametric is limited to only Porsches and limited to 3 vehicles. Yes, I probably won't have more than 3 Porsches in the next 10 years but if I'm shopping for one in the future I would like to be able to plug it into multiple vehicles to figure out history information. Are there any other options out there?

[1schoir]

I considered that but I tend to change out vehicles pretty often and it looks like the Durametric is limited to only Porsches and limited to 3 vehicles. Yes, I probably won't have more than 3 Porsches in the next 10 years but if I'm shopping for one in the future I would like to be able to plug it into multiple vehicles to figure out history information. Are there any other options out there?

If all you want to do is to read and clear codes, you can just get any of the popular code readers, such as those made by Actron.

The one code the code readers will not clear is the airbag light. That can only be done by Durametric, PST2 or PIWIS.

Regards, Maurice.

[kcsporsche]

Quick update. Found the leak. Coolant Expansion Tank problem +0. Idiot +1. It ended up being the hose leading to the engine. The clamp wasn't tight enough. I just tightened up the clamp and viola leak is gone. This is my second clamp issue. Well, to quote Snoop Dogg "You got to check them hose..." Thanks for all the help!!

[judgejon]

Quick update. Found the leak. Coolant Expansion Tank problem +0. Idiot +1. It ended up being the hose leading to the engine. The clamp wasn't tight enough. I just tightened up the clamp and viola leak is gone. This is my second clamp issue. Well, to quote Snoop Dogg "You got to check them hose..." Thanks for all the help!!

ho-ho-hose.... great news. Christmas comes early indeed. Cheers, jl

[1schoir]

Quick update. Found the leak. Coolant Expansion Tank problem +0. Idiot +1. It ended up being the hose leading to the engine. The clamp wasn't tight enough. I just tightened up the clamp and viola leak is gone. This is my second clamp issue. Well, to quote Snoop Dogg "You got to check them hose..." Thanks for all the help!!

Regards, Maurice.

[kcsporsche]

Sorry don't mean to bump the thread, but I just noticed that my coolant color is yellow. I was going to get more coolant and the Porsche Parts Guy said the color should be Pink and that you should not mix coolant types. Should I stick with Yellow coolant? Thanks!!

[Loren]

Sorry don't mean to bump the thread, but I just noticed that my coolant color is yellow. I was going to get more coolant and the Porsche Parts Guy said the color should be Pink and that you should not mix coolant types. Should I stick with Yellow coolant? Thanks!!

The parts guy told you wrong - there is a TSB that clearly states the old (yellow/green) Porsche coolant IS compatible with the new (pink) Porsche coolant.