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JFP in PA

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Everything posted by JFP in PA

  1. JFP in PA
    Very good point Ahsai, thanks for sharing your knowledge.You're welcome. It's been fun following this thread :)Btw to the OP, I think it would still be worthwhile to put a fuse in series with the fan and power it up directly from the battery/ctek. If the fuse blows, we can be sure it's the fan. All it costs is a fuse, no need to get any clamp meter. DO NOT use the CTEK for this, its has only low current capabilities for maintaining memory settings trying to run a 15 amp circuit with it will blow the fuse in the CTEK unit........JFP, thanks for catching that. I didn't realize we're talking about 15A since that fan looks puny to me. Ctek can supply up to 7A in supply mode though for future reference. Use the car battery with a 15A fuse in series then.I just measured my fan (996 c2) using a 12v security backup battey. It draws ~6A initially for a split second then goes to 3.5A at steady state. A lot of people make that expensive mistake, often damaging the CTEK before the fuse lets go.Actually the ctek has circuits to potect itself from overloading in supply mode. Way smarter than I thought. From the owner manual" In this mode, MULTI US 7002 can also be used as a power generation unit for operating equipment that requires 13.6V and a maximum of 7A. If the selected current exceeds 7A, the output voltage will drop as the load increases. The charger has electronic overload protection in this mode, which is activated if the charge is so great that the output voltage from the charger falls below around 9V and the current ís around 7A. In the event of an overload, the charger goes into error mode (lamp 0). Supply mode is indicated with lamp D and lamp 5."Is there also a physical fuse inside? I would expect so for last line of defence....maybe i will open up mine and check. The owner manual doesnt mention any fuse. There is a fuse (3 amp if memory serves) in the line going to the load, it is not in the box itself (the box like bump in the wires): Just to satisfy my own curiosity to see what's inside the US7002 ctek, I opened it up. There is a min-blade 30A fuse soldered in. I figured that they also had some internal protection as well as the external fuses, CTEK is definitely one of the better maintainers out there.
  2. JFP in PA
    The picture from JFP post #80 shows "The Hook" from Power probe inc (around $400.00) but I think the Power probe III can do the job and it is around $100.00 but I think it is not reading amperage. Very few testers can measure amperage because the internals in the meter have to be beefed up to handle the current.
  3. JFP in PA
    Because of the way they are set up, one probe can do a lot of functions, which lets one tech get a lot more accomplished unaided. Power Probe is just one brand, shop around for one that had the best set of features, or happens to be on sale.
  4. JFP in PA
    Most inexpensive multimeters are not designed to handle much of a current load (this is when the current load is passing thru the meter itself), and often have an internal fuse rated at less than 1 amp to protect the meter from being burnt by too much amperage. For future reference, say a birthday or father's day gift, get yourself something like this Power Probe tester: These things cannot only test circuits for continuity and resistance, then can also deliver 12V power to run something like a fan.
  5. JFP in PA
    Most inexpensive multimeters are not designed to handle much of a current load (this is when the current load is passing thru the meter itself), and often have an internal fuse rated at less than 1 amp to protect the meter from being burnt by too much amperage.
  6. JFP in PA
    Very good point Ahsai, thanks for sharing your knowledge.You're welcome. It's been fun following this thread :)Btw to the OP, I think it would still be worthwhile to put a fuse in series with the fan and power it up directly from the battery/ctek. If the fuse blows, we can be sure it's the fan. All it costs is a fuse, no need to get any clamp meter. DO NOT use the CTEK for this, its has only low current capabilities for maintaining memory settings trying to run a 15 amp circuit with it will blow the fuse in the CTEK unit........JFP, thanks for catching that. I didn't realize we're talking about 15A since that fan looks puny to me. Ctek can supply up to 7A in supply mode though for future reference. Use the car battery with a 15A fuse in series then.I just measured my fan (996 c2) using a 12v security backup battey. It draws ~6A initially for a split second then goes to 3.5A at steady state. A lot of people make that expensive mistake, often damaging the CTEK before the fuse lets go.Actually the ctek has circuits to potect itself from overloading in supply mode. Way smarter than I thought. From the owner manual" In this mode, MULTI US 7002 can also be used as a power generation unit for operating equipment that requires 13.6V and a maximum of 7A. If the selected current exceeds 7A, the output voltage will drop as the load increases. The charger has electronic overload protection in this mode, which is activated if the charge is so great that the output voltage from the charger falls below around 9V and the current ís around 7A. In the event of an overload, the charger goes into error mode (lamp 0). Supply mode is indicated with lamp D and lamp 5."Is there also a physical fuse inside? I would expect so for last line of defence....maybe i will open up mine and check. The owner manual doesnt mention any fuse. There is a fuse (3 amp if memory serves) in the line going to the load, it is not in the box itself (the box like bump in the wires):
  7. JFP in PA
    Very good point Ahsai, thanks for sharing your knowledge.You're welcome. It's been fun following this thread :)Btw to the OP, I think it would still be worthwhile to put a fuse in series with the fan and power it up directly from the battery/ctek. If the fuse blows, we can be sure it's the fan. All it costs is a fuse, no need to get any clamp meter. DO NOT use the CTEK for this, its has only low current capabilities for maintaining memory settings trying to run a 15 amp circuit with it will blow the fuse in the CTEK unit........JFP, thanks for catching that. I didn't realize we're talking about 15A since that fan looks puny to me. Ctek can supply up to 7A in supply mode though for future reference. Use the car battery with a 15A fuse in series then.I just measured my fan (996 c2) using a 12v security backup battey. It draws ~6A initially for a split second then goes to 3.5A at steady state. A lot of people make that expensive mistake, often damaging the CTEK before the fuse lets go.
  8. JFP in PA
    Very good point Ahsai, thanks for sharing your knowledge.You're welcome. It's been fun following this thread :)Btw to the OP, I think it would still be worthwhile to put a fuse in series with the fan and power it up directly from the battery/ctek. If the fuse blows, we can be sure it's the fan. All it costs is a fuse, no need to get any clamp meter. DO NOT use the CTEK for this, its has only low current capabilities for maintaining memory settings trying to run a 15 amp circuit with it will blow the fuse in the CTEK unit........
  9. JFP in PA
    It is looking more and more like a fan issue as you have pretty much eliminated everything else. Decent clamp on ammeters (we have a Fluke 325, which is very accurate on the low DC voltage and current you would find in a car), but these things get expensive quickly. We can justify the expense because we use it everyday, but they are a bit much for the DIY market. But as they say, "He who dies with the most tools wins............." Go put your feet up and knock back a couple cold ones. :cheers:
  10. JFP in PA
    Yeah, that would be real popular on the home front.....................not! :eek: Of course I was just kidding JFP!!! I think we can consider Silver fan at fault! I was unable to check the current draw of my fan due to a faulty multimeter. Good to know that I need a new one now!!! Fan part# 996 624 036 04 and only $74.80 at Sonnen.... I knew you were kidding; but my better half goes to great lengths to make sure I am not disturbed when I am away from the shop.
  11. JFP in PA
    The "cool tool" to test the circuit would be a clamp on ammeter: The clamp and the top goes around the wire you want to test and gives very accurate readings of the current draw (amps) on the circuit. But as these things cost about $300, an inline cheap ammeter would be the way to go; or you could jump for this $12 beauty from Harbor Freight:
  12. JFP in PA
    Yeah, that would be real popular on the home front.....................not! :eek:
  13. JFP in PA
    And the fan's current draw would have to be less than the rating on the line fuse.
  14. JFP in PA
    Boy, I take a quiet morning and you guys are having a fun time.............. To check the amperage draw on the circuit at the fan, you will need to put an amp gauge of some sort in line with the circuit at the fan connection.
  15. JFP in PA
    I can do that. One question -- I have a CTek 7002. Doesn't it have a mode where it can actually act as a battery? i wonder if I could use that??? Might be easier than removing the fan if that's possible. No, it has a setting to maintain memory settings, but that is a very low amperage supply. If the circuit is shorted, or the fan it bad, it would simply blow the fuse in the Ctek.
  16. JFP in PA
    With the fan relay out, you want to look at the resistance (you are actually reading continuity) between the terminals on the plug that goes into the fan and a suitable ground point, With the relay out, there should be no path to ground in the harness between the fan and the relay; so when you do this test, you are just looking at the wires and nothing else. You want to spin the fan up for a bit and keep it running to see if it locks up due to a bad bearing or other internal component, which would overload the circuit and blow the fuse.
  17. JFP in PA
    You need to run two wires, one to the battery + terminal, the other to a suitable chassis ground and then touch them to the fan connector to see if it quickly spins up. You can take the fan out of its current location to run this test so the wires are shorter. Just be careful with the + wire and be prepared to pull it away from the fan if the fan blades do not quickly and easily start spinning.
  18. JFP in PA
    I would remove the relay and check the wiring running to the fan, testing both wires for continuity to ground (a short). I would also consider rigging up a set of jumper wires and trying to run the fan by itself (unplugged from the harness) as jpflip is suggesting to see how the fan behaves; while nothing jumped out while checking the fan previously, it is time to see if it actually works.
  19. JFP in PA
    Jpflip has the diagram upside down for some reason (look where the maxi fuse for the air pump is in the diagram vs. your picture)............ The three red colored relays are all the same part numbers; #8 is the fan, #9 is spoiler retract, and in the bottom row #3 is spoiler extension. If you need, I can scan a photo from the manual (looks just like your photo) and post it with the relay locations.
  20. JFP in PA
    Top row, second from right is #8 (red in color), #9 (next one over to the left on top row) should be the spoiler retract relay and have the same part #.
  21. JFP in PA
    Fingers crossed..........................
  22. JFP in PA
    One other thing... when I'm able to get to the relays and do the swap, assuming for the moment that the fan relay is bad, should I be plugging this into the slot that I took the relay from the spoilers? In other words if this is a bad relay, won't it blow the fuse for the spoilers too? Or would I want to try by taking the relay from the spoilers..... using that for the engine purge fan while leaving its original slot empty (not sure what electrical implications that would have but prefer not to break anything else in the process while testing). Just a thought as I'm trying to think through this. Also, is the relay #8 I'm seeking on the driver's side or passenger's side once I'm able to get this carpeted segment off? I know this is an awefully verbose sequence but hopefully when I'm able to solve this it helps something else in the future that finds this thread........ Relay panel #2 is on the driver's side of the shelf area (the engine DME should be on the other side). I totally forgot about the Bose option that requires removal of the fasteners to get the parcel trim panel up to gain access to the relays, cars without the Bose are not as complicated. Remove the two fasteners under the Bose "vents" and the shelf should slide forward. I would pull the existing suspect #8 relay out completely and move the spoiler relay (#9) into the #8 slot and then reconnect the fan to test the circuit. If everything works OK (fuse does not pop) and the Durametric can run the engine compartment fan without issue, you will need another relay. At that point, you can move the relay back into #9 slot and just leave the engine fan relay out until you get a new one (the car will code for the missing relay), or leave the relay in the engine fan slot and live with out your spoiler until the new relay is available. Aren't electrical diagnostics fun? :eek:
  23. JFP in PA
    It sounds like the fan may be OK as you do not seem to be getting continuity between the housing and the wire connections. The #8 relay that controls the fan should be the same part number that is used to control the movable spoilers on these cars, so the easiest move may be to simply try to swap the relay and reconnect the fan and turn on the ignition to see if the fuse doesn't blow with the new relay in; if that is in fact what happens, it is the relay, which is much cheaper than a new fan.
  24. JFP in PA
    Before going to check the relay, check the fan connections to the fan housing for a short to ground (you should see no continuity between either wire connection and the housing).
  25. JFP in PA
    You have it set too high, turn the meter down to 200 ohms, then if you touch the two meter leads together, your meter should read either "0" or some very small value near "0". If the fan is still reading "0" that means it is an open circuit with no resistance, which is highly unlikely for an electric motor. If you get a Ohm reading on the motor circuit at the lower setting, note it and then try getting a reading between each of the fan's connections and a bear metal area on the fan housing (you are looking for a short). If you get a "0" or near "0" reading between either wire and the housing, that is a short. Neither wire should indicate continuity to the fan housing. Next try the same test on the harness that connects to the fan, check the two wires first, then each one to a chassis ground (one should be a ground, but both should not read as having continuity to ground). If both read as continuous to ground, there is a short in the harness or the relay is shorted.
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