Oil change, P1130 and P1128 less than two weeks later, followed by a s

[shyster77]

Hello everyone,

I don't know if I should call it a string of possibly related events or just a mere coincidence here.

I had an oil change less than 3 weeks ago, a week ago the CEL came on, over a course of turning it off and it coming back on, P1130 and P1128 were noted.

My mechanic feels that I need to have a MAF replaced.

Sadly, the convertible top stopped moving 3 weeks ago too - the parking light comes on, but the clamshell tries to own and then there is only a mere twitching sound from the back. Is there any way one can diagnose what may cause this too? :huh:

So now my mechanic is left with having to manually open the top and then get to the MAF - I hear atleast two hours of labor already :(

Also a week ago, at low speeds or at idle (at least less than 2K rpm), there is an annoying squealing sound from the rear of the car (seems closer to the rear tires but I could be off). My mechanic feels that it may be one of the parts in the clutch that may be giving away though he test drove the car and felt that the clutch was fine. When the clutch is pushed in though, or when the rpm crosses 2k or the car is moved steadily, the squeal goes away. Please note that the clutch hasn't been replaced so far.

Just curious - are any of these related (clearly not the convertible top issue) but oil change, and then these error codes and possibly the squealing sound from the rear of the car.

I have 102K on the odo - have had the car since 2006 when it had 58K miles on it. Had its 60K and its 90K miles done timely - also ended up having to replace the A/C system (:cursing:) and the engine mounts, cv boots with the axles having to be lubed too.

I use my car as a daily driver and log approx 35 miles/day - don't race or drive it hard.

Also curious - do Boxsters get really expensive to maintain from here on too?

Appreciate your insights and feedback here.

A-Boxster-Lover-Though-Now-A-Fiscally-Concerned-Driver

[juniinc]

I had both p1128,1130 about a few weeks ago.

It was the AOS in my case.

I would check the oil cap, while she is running,,,

[shyster77]

I had both p1128,1130 about a few weeks ago.

It was the AOS in my case.

I would check the oil cap, while she is running,,,

Thanks a bunch for your reply, juniinc!

How do I do this?

[juniinc]

See if it is difficult to remove the cap while running.

put your hand over, feel for any vacumm suction,,,

[wvicary]

I also agree the common fault is the AOS. If your mechanic is charging you two hours to manually open the top, find another garage.

[Beelzy]

I would find another mechanic anyway........He couldn't diagnose the AOS issue (most likely the problem here) which is pretty basic on P-cars. :rolleyes:

As for the top, this is another issue that usually involves a little $$.

[1schoir]

.....

Sadly, the convertible top stopped moving 3 weeks ago too - the parking light comes on, but the clamshell tries to own and then there is only a mere twitching sound from the back. Is there any way one can diagnose what may cause this too? :huh: .........

A-Boxster-Lover-Though-Now-A-Fiscally-Concerned-Driver

If you could post more specific details about how and when the top malfunctioned, I'm sure we could figure out how to get it in working order again, without spending lots of $$$.

Maybe start a separate thread for the top issue.

Regards, Maurice.

[shyster77]

Thanks a lot for the replies, folks.

The mechanic is an independent shop and has been around for nearly 40 years now. So quite reputed and works out of reference mostly.

The CEL diagnosis comes to a faulty MAF. Top diagnosis comes down to one gearhead gone bad and the other one getting there. Pelican parts quotes each of these parts at approx $650/pop. So seems like a replacement of both is required and this is where it is going to get pricey.

Since the car is in the shop, he said he will charge me 3 hours of labor for all - top fix and MAF replacement. If I decided to do it later, then he will have to charge me a couple of hours to put all the top pieces back back (though the MAF labor will be a tiny fraction of this) and then charge me 3 hours another day when I decide to fix the top.

I may be looking at approx $2K for everything here.

I guess I'm going to have to bite this one. But seriously considering buying a second car for a daily driver - there is a squeal sound when the car idles or at low rpm (<2k) which disappears when the clutch is pushed in, though my mechanic feels that this can be taken care of when the clutch needs to be replaced.

So far this year, including this will be approx $3K. Last year between the AC, engine mounts, CV boots, Axles - $3K+ too.

I love this car but worried about this $3K+ a year commitement to something that is barely worth $12K. While car ownership economics ensures that fix-and-go is much inexpensive than the depreciation of the 2nd car, bites like these require large gulps :unsure:

[shyster77]

And I did try to open the oil cap when the engine was idling - it was pretty well sucked in so I presumed that the AOS should be fine when I took it in.

Maurice - Appreciate your interest in helping me save this money here - so I figured for 3 hours of labor - let me just got done with all that needs to be taken care of - since it is already in the shop and hopefully can remain trouble free for sometime (*fingers crossed*)

As much as I hate these bills, man, I keep falling in love with this car, all over again, every time I turn on the ignition... :D

Next time I have an issue, I'm going to head over to :renntech: - as soon as possible, with the required gear and look out for your inputs. :thankyou:

Edited October 27, 2010 by shyster77

[1schoir]

And I did try to open the oil cap when the engine was idling - it was pretty well sucked in so I presumed that the AOS should be fine when I took it in.

Maurice - Appreciate your interest in helping me save this money here - so I figured for 3 hours of labor - let me just got done with all that needs to be taken care of - since it is already in the shop and hopefully can remain trouble free for sometime (*fingers crossed*)

As much as I hate these bills, man, I keep falling in love with this car, all over again, every time I turn on the ignition... :D

Next time I have an issue, I'm going to head over to :renntech: - as soon as possible, with the required gear and look out for your inputs. :thankyou:

Shyster:

$3K once a year, if it keeps up, is a BIG GULP!

3 hours of labor for replacing the MAF (15 minutes) and removing and replacing the transmissions is a reasonable amount of time.

Rather than spending $650 per transmission, I would recommend buying a set of used transmissions...generally available for anywhere between $200 to $350 a pair. Lots of guys who turn their cars into Spec Racers have no use for the transmissions and will readily sell them. "Brad Roberts", who is a member of Renntech, is very connected with the Spec Racing scene, so you may want to send him a PM to see if he can help you out.

Also, regardless of whether you buy used or new transmissions, DEFINITELY buy the "B Version" transmissions, made by "Stehle". Those transmissions are a direct bolt-in for your '99, even while staying with the A-Version microswitch set-up in the early cars. The only extra parts needed to retrofit the B Version transmissions are the six mounting studs (3 on each side). Take a look at page 11, paragraph B.4. for the part numbers for the new studs, in the Part I PDF of this write-up: http://sites.google.com/site/mikefocke2/installinga'03-'04glasstopandframeona'97 . Also look at paragraph 9 of page 21 of the Part II PDF of the same write-up for photos of the two different types of studs.

The B Version transmissions are more reliable. Also, if you decide to replace your top with an OEM '03 or '04 glass-windowed top later on, you will be ahead of the game.

We all know what you mean by what happens every time you turn the key!

Regards, Maurice.

[shyster77]

And I did try to open the oil cap when the engine was idling - it was pretty well sucked in so I presumed that the AOS should be fine when I took it in.

Maurice - Appreciate your interest in helping me save this money here - so I figured for 3 hours of labor - let me just got done with all that needs to be taken care of - since it is already in the shop and hopefully can remain trouble free for sometime (*fingers crossed*)

As much as I hate these bills, man, I keep falling in love with this car, all over again, every time I turn on the ignition... :D

Next time I have an issue, I'm going to head over to :renntech: - as soon as possible, with the required gear and look out for your inputs. :thankyou:

Shyster:

$3K once a year, if it keeps up, is a BIG GULP!

3 hours of labor for replacing the MAF (15 minutes) and removing and replacing the transmissions is a reasonable amount of time.

Rather than spending $650 per transmission, I would recommend buying a set of used transmissions...generally available for anywhere between $200 to $350 a pair. Lots of guys who turn their cars into Spec Racers have no use for the transmissions and will readily sell them. "Brad Roberts", who is a member of Renntech, is very connected with the Spec Racing scene, so you may want to send him a PM to see if he can help you out.

Also, regardless of whether you buy used or new transmissions, DEFINITELY buy the "B Version" transmissions, made by "Stehle". Those transmissions are a direct bolt-in for your '99, even while staying with the A-Version microswitch set-up in the early cars. The only extra parts needed to retrofit the B Version transmissions are the six mounting studs (3 on each side). Take a look at page 11, paragraph B.4. for the part numbers for the new studs, in the Part I PDF of this write-up: http://sites.google.com/site/mikefocke2/installinga'03-'04glasstopandframeona'97 . Also look at paragraph 9 of page 21 of the Part II PDF of the same write-up for photos of the two different types of studs.

The B Version transmissions are more reliable. Also, if you decide to replace your top with an OEM '03 or '04 glass-windowed top later on, you will be ahead of the game.

We all know what you mean by what happens every time you turn the key!

Regards, Maurice.

Good feedback again, Maurice. I will keep this in mind for the next set of fixes (hopefully a long time for the convertible parts).

The transmissions are Genuine Porsche ones so will have to look into Stehle the next time, I get there. I had a plastic window stitched in a couple of years ago so that seems clean for now - though the canvas may be looking for a replacement some time.

Just curious - how to tell if the clutch is wearing out and need to be replaced?

The squeal that I seem to get when the engine idles or at low speeds but goes away when the clutch is pressed - is expected to be a bearing that may be giving away, according to my mechanic. Sometimes I feel that when I take my foot off the gas, the car takes a moment before it slows down - I wonder if this is due to a worn clutch. I dont have the clutch immersed during this time though.

My mechanic is quoting $1500 for a clutch replacement though does not include the flywheel which from his experience of 35-40yrs of Porsches seem pretty solid on the Boxster. Is this reasonable?

I ended up with $2221 for the MAF + Top transmissions (#2) + air filter + 3 hours of labor btw.

Nice ding on my savings but does feel fab to have the top down in Phoenix, this time of the year :thumbup:

[Steve Tinker]

Regarding your AOS - if I read your post correctly you tried to remove the oil cap with the engine running and it was difficult to remove. This a good indication you have a failing AOS. The other clues when an AOS fails is it can give off a squealing sound and also the engine smokes from the exhaust on startup.....

DON'T wait too long before replacing the AOS as in extreme conditions, enough oil can be dragged up into the combustion chambers and will hydrolock - you don't want a bent con rod......

[shyster77]

Regarding your AOS - if I read your post correctly you tried to remove the oil cap with the engine running and it was difficult to remove. This a good indication you have a failing AOS. The other clues when an AOS fails is it can give off a squealing sound and also the engine smokes from the exhaust on startup.....

DON'T wait too long before replacing the AOS as in extreme conditions, enough oil can be dragged up into the combustion chambers and will hydrolock - you don't want a bent con rod......

Hi Steve,

Thanks for the follow-up.

This is quite revealing - my mechanic diagnosed the P1130 and P1128 to be due to the MAF, during the Porsche diagnostics but your point worries me.

Is replacing the AOS is a DIY?

Now that the top works and I have access to the engine compartment - I wonder if I could replace this as preventative maintenance.

The point about the squeal - when exactly would the squeal happen if the AOS is going bad. I get the squeal at low speeds or at idle - the squeal goes away when the clutch is depressed.

Thanks again for the follow up..

[1schoir]

Good feedback again, Maurice. I will keep this in mind for the next set of fixes (hopefully a long time for the convertible parts).

The transmissions are Genuine Porsche ones so will have to look into Stehle the next time, I get there. I had a plastic window stitched in a couple of years ago so that seems clean for now - though the canvas may be looking for a replacement some time.

Just curious - how to tell if the clutch is wearing out and need to be replaced?

The squeal that I seem to get when the engine idles or at low speeds but goes away when the clutch is pressed - is expected to be a bearing that may be giving away, according to my mechanic. Sometimes I feel that when I take my foot off the gas, the car takes a moment before it slows down - I wonder if this is due to a worn clutch. I dont have the clutch immersed during this time though.

My mechanic is quoting $1500 for a clutch replacement though does not include the flywheel which from his experience of 35-40yrs of Porsches seem pretty solid on the Boxster. Is this reasonable?

I ended up with $2221 for the MAF + Top transmissions (#2) + air filter + 3 hours of labor btw.

Nice ding on my savings but does feel fab to have the top down in Phoenix, this time of the year :thumbup:

Shyster:

Enjoy the top down driving, it's getting a little nippy on Long Island this time of year but I'm still squeezing in a couple of those days!

Note that the Stehle brand transmissions are the OEM transmissions that Porsche switched to when they went to the "B Version" set up.

Regards, Maurice.

[shyster77]

Good feedback again, Maurice. I will keep this in mind for the next set of fixes (hopefully a long time for the convertible parts).

The transmissions are Genuine Porsche ones so will have to look into Stehle the next time, I get there. I had a plastic window stitched in a couple of years ago so that seems clean for now - though the canvas may be looking for a replacement some time.

Just curious - how to tell if the clutch is wearing out and need to be replaced?

The squeal that I seem to get when the engine idles or at low speeds but goes away when the clutch is pressed - is expected to be a bearing that may be giving away, according to my mechanic. Sometimes I feel that when I take my foot off the gas, the car takes a moment before it slows down - I wonder if this is due to a worn clutch. I dont have the clutch immersed during this time though.

My mechanic is quoting $1500 for a clutch replacement though does not include the flywheel which from his experience of 35-40yrs of Porsches seem pretty solid on the Boxster. Is this reasonable?

I ended up with $2221 for the MAF + Top transmissions (#2) + air filter + 3 hours of labor btw.

Nice ding on my savings but does feel fab to have the top down in Phoenix, this time of the year :thumbup:

Shyster:

Enjoy the top down driving, it's getting a little nippy on Long Island this time of year but I'm still squeezing in a couple of those days!

Note that the Stehle brand transmissions are the OEM transmissions that Porsche switched to when they went to the "B Version" set up.

Regards, Maurice.

Ah ha @ your Stehle point about OEM. I will check with my mechanic to see if he put that in - I'm assuming if one has to buy OEM parts for a 986 Boxster, this one would be what they would get - which, of course, would be nice....

Thanks, Maurice - this is exactly why I had that replacement asap - from now to say April/May - top has to be down :jump:

The box has been my only ride for the past 6 months (use to have a daily driver before) and I may still end up getting a daily driver soon, to reduce the mileage pileup on the box, but again, the top has to be down for the next 7 months B)

Long Island, huh - have fun while it is still possible with the top down :)

[shyster77]

Regarding your AOS - if I read your post correctly you tried to remove the oil cap with the engine running and it was difficult to remove. This a good indication you have a failing AOS. The other clues when an AOS fails is it can give off a squealing sound and also the engine smokes from the exhaust on startup.....

DON'T wait too long before replacing the AOS as in extreme conditions, enough oil can be dragged up into the combustion chambers and will hydrolock - you don't want a bent con rod......

Steve, you rock!

Got the CEL back on today and the same codes - P1130 and P1128.

I'm 100% sure now that it was the AOS that needed to be replaced and need to make sure that my mechanic doesn't charge me for this since he misdiagnosed it to be a failing MAF.

Just curious - how is the AOS replacement for DIY?

[shyster77]

This thread just summed up my issue with the CEL and the engine squeal.

My mechanic wasted my money on a MAF!

[Steve Tinker]

Although I havn't actually replaced my AOS (it was replaced @ 40,000 miles under the Porsche extended warranty), Mike Fochs "how to" pretty much covers it, although I believe the hardest part is re-installing the spring clips.

I've heard of shops here in Australia replacing a suspect sqealing clutch and then ringing the owner to say they have also just found a faulty AOS as well. So you get slugged for a clutch that didn't need replacing as well as a new AOS.....

[1schoir]

This thread just summed up my issue with the CEL and the engine squeal.

http://www.renntech....__1#entry180540

My mechanic wasted my money on a MAF!

Shyster:

Here is an old thread that was resurrected recently by Boxtaboy and that contains excellent DIY instructions and photos on replacing the AOS: http://www.renntech....__1#entry186607

I recently helped Boxtaboy replace his AOS and, if you are going to use the factory clamp (my preference as well), the tool shown in post #26 or a pair of cable-operated or other good hose clamp pliers is indispensable. The little blue plastic tool comes with the OEM clamp if you order the clamp from a dealer.

That lower clamp is the only somewhat difficult part of the AOS replacement. I've also done it a couple of times with heavy duty cable ties that you can first set up to squeeze the ends of the OEM clamp together, and then cut them off once it's positioned and seated properly.

It also makes it much easier if you get the right rear wheel off and the rear of the car up high enough so that you can comfortably reach in there.

Keep us posted.

Regards, Maurice.

[shyster77]

Although I havn't actually replaced my AOS (it was replaced @ 40,000 miles under the Porsche extended warranty), Mike Fochs "how to" pretty much covers it, although I believe the hardest part is re-installing the spring clips.

I've heard of shops here in Australia replacing a suspect sqealing clutch and then ringing the owner to say they have also just found a faulty AOS as well. So you get slugged for a clutch that didn't need replacing as well as a new AOS.....

I would have been there too, Steve, if not for RennTech.

Dating back to since when the squeal began, that was like a week after the CEL came on.

Just a month ago, my mechanic tested my clutch (with approx 98K miles on it) and said it felt fine.

And the squeal was more of a whistle (like pressurized air) than two mechanical parts grinding.

So too much of a coincidence for the vacuum leak and a failing clutch to happen, at the same time.

What annoyed me the most was that CEL comes out, and the mechanic uses Porsche diagnostic tools to determine it was a failing MAF and then attributes the squeal to a clutch, and is incorrect with both!

[shyster77]

Shyster:

Here is an old thread that was resurrected recently by Boxtaboy and that contains excellent DIY instructions and photos on replacing the AOS: http://www.renntech....__1#entry186607

I recently helped Boxtaboy replace his AOS and, if you are going to use the factory clamp (my preference as well), the tool shown in post #26 or a pair of cable-operated or other good hose clamp pliers is indispensable. The little blue plastic tool comes with the OEM clamp if you order the clamp from a dealer.

That lower clamp is the only somewhat difficult part of the AOS replacement. I've also done it a couple of times with heavy duty cable ties that you can first set up to squeeze the ends of the OEM clamp together, and then cut them off once it's positioned and seated properly.

It also makes it much easier if you get the right rear wheel off and the rear of the car up high enough so that you can comfortably reach in there.

Keep us posted.

Regards, Maurice.

Thanks, Maurice.

I took my car to my chief mechanic today and explained the problem statement again - P1130/P1128 + engine squeal at low speeds/idle, inspite of the new MAF.

He still felt that it may not be due to the AOS, until I asked him to try taking the oil cap off. The mechanic who was going to work on it, struggled a bit and there was a nice long hiss when he finally managed to get it off, when the engine was idling. He said - Yep, it surely feels like the AOS. And I told them - yep - my weekend was spent on RennTech to get to this diagnosis ;)

They mentioned that they frequent RennTech too for tips and said that the folks here are very helpful (Of course, need I be reminded of this! :renntech: )

They took out the MAF and replaced the cost of that with the AOS (I'd already paid for this as a part of my top fix) so hopefully this should take care of the error codes and the squeal.

If my MAF is bad too, I will replace it myself, now that the engine is accessible due to the top transmissions being fixed.

Thanks a lot for all your help! :thankyou:

[1schoir]

Thanks, Maurice.

I took my car to my chief mechanic today and explained the problem statement again - P1130/P1128 + engine squeal at low speeds/idle, inspite of the new MAF.

He still felt that it may not be due to the AOS, until I asked him to try taking the oil cap off. The mechanic who was going to work on it, struggled a bit and there was a nice long hiss when he finally managed to get it off, when the engine was idling. He said - Yep, it surely feels like the AOS. And I told them - yep - my weekend was spent on RennTech to get to this diagnosis ;)

They mentioned that they frequent RennTech too for tips and said that the folks here are very helpful (Of course, need I be reminded of this! :renntech: )

They took out the MAF and replaced the cost of that with the AOS (I'd already paid for this as a part of my top fix) so hopefully this should take care of the error codes and the squeal.

If my MAF is bad too, I will replace it myself, now that the engine is accessible due to the top transmissions being fixed.

Thanks a lot for all your help! :thankyou:

Shyster:

Looks like they may have gotten it right this time. You should immediately be able to tell whether the squeal is gone, and the codes will take a little longer until you go through the cycles.

Nice of them to agree to take back the MAF and credit you with the cost of that repair towards the AOS. Although logic and decency dictate that this is the only right thing to do, a lot of shops would have come up with some excuse to avoid responsibility and tag you for an additonal expense.

If you do end up having to replace the MAF, that's about a 10 minute job, and all you need a is "security" torx bit. A whole set of those is available from HarborFreight.com for a few dollars.

Keep us posted.

Regards, Maurice.

[shyster77]

Maurice,

Is it too much of a coincidence that the issues with the CEL and squealing sound has gone away with the AOS replacement but an oil leak from the rear of the car has begun....I'm trying to locate the exact spot where this leak is happening - but I wonder if it may have to do with this replacement.

Any ideas?

I will update tomorrow as soon as I find the leaky spot too.

[shyster77]

Maurice,

Is it too much of a coincidence that the issues with the CEL and squealing sound has gone away with the AOS replacement but an oil leak from the rear of the car has begun....I'm trying to locate the exact spot where this leak is happening - but I wonder if it may have to do with this replacement.

Any ideas?

I will update tomorrow as soon as I find the leaky spot too.

No leak overnight (from last night, at least)...

[1schoir]

Maurice,

Is it too much of a coincidence that the issues with the CEL and squealing sound has gone away with the AOS replacement but an oil leak from the rear of the car has begun....I'm trying to locate the exact spot where this leak is happening - but I wonder if it may have to do with this replacement.

Any ideas?

I will update tomorrow as soon as I find the leaky spot too.

If the leak that suddenly popped up has disappeared, it may just have been some residual oil that dripped out during the replacement of the AOS. After all, a failing AOS will have various levels of oil accumulation inside the J tube, etc...

If the leak continues, then you have to at least investigate and make certain that all of the connections to and from the AOS were securely made. If it continues to leak, post again and I'll post some photos of the 4 or 5 connection points to double check as the possible source of a leak.

Regards, Maurice.