Another IMS DIY

[Stakeman]

Hey all, got the tranny out, visually verified I have a double row bearing(backing up my assumptions from the engine #) and just ordered my LN bearing. I've read and reread many threads on the install. Wayne from pellican has a great informative thread on the whole process....very impressive! Before going any further I have some questions for those who have done this before. I guess my biggest one is What if I lock my engine at TDC pull my 2 exhaust cam covers mark them and my intermidiate shaft sprocket doesn't line up? Wayne had a great idea of using set screws to hold the IMS from moving buy pulling the IMS bearing cover and using set screws in the 3 bolt holes! sounds great .....BUT.... what if, with the engine at TDC and the cam locks in.... the holes in the sprocket are NOT where the set screws go in? Wayne made it clear to turn the srocket so you screw into the sprocket and not air.....but if you do that your not going to be at TDC! Unless the stars all align and at TDC you have sprocket behind all 3 holes. Anyone at TDC use the set screws to hold the IMS in place?? Thanks in advance...

[JFP in PA]

I’m probably going to start a feud with this, but here goes: Don’t use the set screw procedure. While many have been successful going this route, many more have not. First of all, the set screws do not provide adequate protection against the cams jumping time, particularly in a three chain motor. Secondly, the rear IMS shaft gear is press fit; too much force by the set screws can dislodge the gear, which requires disassembly of the engine to correct.

LN Engineering and Jake Raby developed a procedure that totally eliminates the chance of the cam timing moving by locking the engine at TDC, locking the cams in place with fixtures, and removing the chain tensioners to facilitate pulling and replacing the IMS bearing. This procedure works, every time, and without any drama.

You can read more about it here: http://www.lnenginee...imsretrofit.pdf

Edited October 22, 2012 by JFP in PA

[feds27]

Here's the DIY video from the Bentley Wiki.

Edited October 23, 2012 by feds27

[Stakeman]

Thanks for the responses. I spent a whole lot of time looking into the different ways this has been done. Based on what i've seen I'll be locking the cams. I really do not see how the chains will slip time with the tensioners out either way especially with a 5 chain. That being said I will follow the LN directions to a t! It does seem a little paranoid that the cams will slip a cog with the tensioners out and all pressure off the chains prior to removing the bearing though. thanks for the point about the sporcket in the above post!

[JFP in PA]

Typically, the timing jumps because of valve spring pressure against the cams, which will try to rotate the engine if everything is not locked down.

Edited October 23, 2012 by JFP in PA

[Stakeman]

Typically, the timing jumps because of valve spring pressure against the cams, which will try to rotate the engine if everything is not locked down.

Make sense. Didn't think of the load from the valve springs.

[valley996]

I just did mine on 99 996. It was a little hard to pull the bearing, but it finally popped out. The new one went in great. I highly recommend the LN kit.

[Stakeman]

I just did mine on 99 996. It was a little hard to pull the bearing, but it finally popped out. The new one went in great. I highly recommend the LN kit.

Single or Double row? I have the LN on the way... Mines a double

[valley996]

Double row

[Stakeman]

Job is done!! I did take pics but honestly they look just like the other threads. It went very smooth, without any surprises. The hardest part was the dang slave cylinder install. I had intended to stick it back on before getting the tranny all the way back in and actually forgot! The tranny went in in 20 minutes which really did surprise me! Let me tell you how I finally got the slave back in after literally hours of trying. The hard part is you have to compress the shaft of the slave to get the mounting ear lines up with the bolt holes(pushing HARD!) then you have to try and get the threads started while holding force on the slave.....(It SUCKS)! Finally my trick was to find a drill bit that fit snug in the bolt hole, and sick it almost all the way into the ear the bolt goes through on the slave... Then compress the slave and when you have it lined up push the bit into the bolt hole to hold the compressed cylinder in place.... I used the bottom hole for this because it is MUCH easier to get the bolt in the top hole! Once the top bolt is in it's pretty easy to line up and get the bottom in! It took me 45 minutes to get the bottom bolt out so I spent the money on a ratcheting 13mm wrench and to was awesome putting the bottom bolt in(took 2 minutes)!

All in all it really was pretty easy! LN has a great kit for this(which BTW I will now sell)... I would not hesitate to do this again in the future. Oh one more thing! make sure you make a list of all you need to complete this job before ordering the parts! I forgot the clutch alignment tool and totally lucked out and found one that matched the spine and dimensions at Oriley's!

If anyone is interested in the LN install kit I'll sell it for 150 shipping included.

[Y2K911]

How was the shape of your double row bearing? Were the bearings coming loose in any way in their races? Mileage? I have a 00 C2 at 87k mi still on original IMS, which I believe, is a double row, but not entirely sure given Porsche went single row that year. Thanks!

Martin

[Stakeman]

I was surprised how good the old bearing looked actually. There was a considerable amount of fine debris in the shaft area. The bearing itself looked good however there was some slop in the center stud so it was getting some wear. My car is a 99' with 43k. I really need to spend some time getting some pics up its a clean car, even better now with the LN upgrade.

[Y2K911]

Appreciate your reply, Stakeman and congrats on your new IMS bearing!

Martin

[krazyk]

Hey Stakeman, what was the part number for the clutch align tool at Oreillys, please?

[NorCalTransplant]

Love to see the pictures when you have the time.

[Stakeman]

Hey Stakeman, what was the part number for the clutch align tool at Oreillys, please?

Sorry it took forever to get back to you krazyk! I don't have the packaging with the pn.. Basically I found the measurements and spline count and just matched it up with a micrometer from the store. It was so close I gave it a shot and the fit was perfect when I used it! I thought I may need to use some electrical tape to make the pilot bearing area a hair thicker but even with one wrap of tape it was way too thick... Sorry I couldn't be of more help.

[987_RDC]

Anyone run into the need to fab up an adapter for the LN tool to get the bearing out? I had to weld two nuts together to have the correct threads on a '99 bolt.

[RRRUFF]

Job is done!! I did take pics but honestly they look just like the other threads. It went very smooth, without any surprises. The hardest part was the dang slave cylinder install. I had intended to stick it back on before getting the tranny all the way back in and actually forgot! The tranny went in in 20 minutes which really did surprise me! Let me tell you how I finally got the slave back in after literally hours of trying. The hard part is you have to compress the shaft of the slave to get the mounting ear lines up with the bolt holes(pushing HARD!) then you have to try and get the threads started while holding force on the slave.....(It SUCKS)! Finally my trick was to find a drill bit that fit snug in the bolt hole, and sick it almost all the way into the ear the bolt goes through on the slave... Then compress the slave and when you have it lined up push the bit into the bolt hole to hold the compressed cylinder in place.... I used the bottom hole for this because it is MUCH easier to get the bolt in the top hole! Once the top bolt is in it's pretty easy to line up and get the bottom in! It took me 45 minutes to get the bottom bolt out so I spent the money on a ratcheting 13mm wrench and to was awesome putting the bottom bolt in(took 2 minutes)!

All in all it really was pretty easy! LN has a great kit for this(which BTW I will now sell)... I would not hesitate to do this again in the future. Oh one more thing! make sure you make a list of all you need to complete this job before ordering the parts! I forgot the clutch alignment tool and totally lucked out and found one that matched the spine and dimensions at Oriley's!

If anyone is interested in the LN install kit I'll sell it for 150 shipping included.

Thanks for the post. Other than the LN install kit and the Clutch alignment tool can you share your list of parts and tools with the rest of us? BTW what was your final tally on actual hands-on time?

[Stakeman]

RRRUFF, most of the tools needed I had in my box. I do know one of the things I didn't have was a 36mm socket to remove and install the tensioners. I wish I would have payed more attention to what sizes everything was. I also bought new cam shaft end plugs(x2). I used a pick tool to remove the old ones and honestly...if you have some good clear silicone you could easily clean and repair the pin hole from removal. But for 13 bucks each I just went with the new plugs (I also used some thread sealer when installing the new ones). Make sure you have some LONG extensions for the bell housing bolts I used a 2 foot extension and once broke loose an air ratchet is a huge advantage. Make sure to remember which bolts go where as there are several different lengths, I used a piece of cardboard and drew out the pattern.

As far as total time actually turning wrenches under the car??? Once in the air, tranny coming out took about 2 hours, clutch was another 45 minutes to an hour, cam locks removing tensioners and prepping/ cleaning block area for IMS bearing another hour or so.. The actual bearing pull and install did not take that long, I was very careful to follow the directions word for word....sometimes twice so it took longer than it had to. I'd say around an 1.5 hours. (you need to allow the new bearing to sit in the freezer overnight though). Going back together went real quick(with the exception of the slave cylinder) around 3 hours... Then the slave is the big unknown?? I spent a REAL long time jacking around with that! Like another 3+ hours...Did I mention it sucked? Total time? My best guess would be around 10 hours for me. Keep in mind this is not my daily driver and I spread this out over several days. By doing that I think it made the job more enjoyable, especially when dealing with the slave cylinder! I just walked away for a while and came back when I regained my patience! If you had "everything" you needed this can be done over a weekend, but for me personally I wouldn't have had as much fun. Best of luck, I'd do it again without a doubt!

[Cefalu]

The slave cylinder took me, maybe 15 minutes tops. The trick is to install it while the trans is still tipped down. It's very easy to get to the bolts then. Once the trans is tilted back up its very difficult access as you found.

Same trick holds true for removal. Tip down first.

[Stakeman]

The slave cylinder took me, maybe 15 minutes tops. The trick is to install it while the trans is still tipped down. It's very easy to get to the bolts then. Once the trans is tilted back up its very difficult access as you found.

Same trick holds true for removal. Tip down first.

You know I read about doing just that before I even attempted to install and intended to do that. But honestly I was apprehensive about lining up the bell housing bolts and stabbing in the tranny sooo..... let my better judgement slip and didn't do it! Next time I will for sure. Let me ask, even with the tranny down a few inches I really didn't see how it would yield much more room unless you leave it really low then jack it up. To me it looked like I'd have to have it at least 12 inches low to gain more room then I had concerns about pinching the line when jacking it into position. Thanks for the input, I'm interested in how low you were when putting the slave in and did the coiled up hard line get in the way when raising the tranny up?

[Cefalu]

I had the tranny bolted to the engine for both the removal and install of the slave.

The trick for me was removal of the tranny mount first that allowed the nose of the trans to rotate down. That leaves just enough room to have reasonable access to the slave bolts.

I had heard how horrible the slave job was, so I was trying to make sure I did not find myself struggling with it.

[Stakeman]

Next time I'm doing it your way for sure! I was almost at the point of pulling it back out to start the slave....Yes, it was that bad! For those doing this for the first time please learn from my mistake...

[greg0d]

Last month I got a letter from Porsche Japan saying that the intermediate shaft may need to be replaced and to bring it to the dealer for inspection. If it does need replacing it will be done free of charge. BTW, I did not buy my car from the dealer and have only gone there to get my doors reprogrammed.

Has anybody from any other country been contacted by Porsche on this?

[Y2K911]

Could you please post a copy of said letter to this thread to add credibility to your statement? Thank you!